As Xbox Expands Its Reach, Former PlayStation Boss Talks About The Viability Of Consoles

Consoles will be around for a good amount of time until cloud takes the casuals away. Once the causals leave consoles, consoles die cause there isn’t enough hardcore gamers to make them profitable. When a causal player can just play FIFA, and madden on the cloud via an app on the TV they ain’t buying a $400-$600 box to play it. Thats when the console dies. Cause that same player isn’t buying a PC to play FIFA and Madden. The hardcore will go to PC and the casual will go to steaming cloud apps but as to when that happens? No clue. But the console was a huge bridge before online became a thing. Now in the world of internet and apps on TV’s it’s a little on borrowed time from a causals point of view, which hurts me cause i am one of the few million that is hardcore to the console.

"Let's put Nintendo aside for a second, because they live in their Own Private Idaho, where the laws of physics apply in different sorts of ways."

LOL! Spot on!

He is right. The home console is likely reaching the end of the rope. I hardly touch my ps5 because I no longer like the idea of my games being locked to one device/monitor. Buying those Playstation games on Steam is much more convenient as I can take the steam deck or rog ally and use those as handheld or home consoles and also on the pc.

I doubt games will be that much more technically impressive in 15 years because the focus will be on having the games running on many devices like handheld, laptops, mobiles, and whatever Nintendo has out.

There will probably still be dedicated consoles from Sony and Xbox but they will be one of many devices capable of playing games from the Playstation and Xbox apps.

I bet even nintendo comes around to this eventually.

@somnambulance My thoughts exactly. There’s probably some semblance of truth and wisdom in his words, but he’s a good executive. A darn good executive. He knows how to steer perception toward whatever is the current agenda is; he’s done it well at Sony in the past and he’s probably doing just as good at ChinaDime.

Console are here to stay except if your on xbox

@HonestHick not every country has good enough internet to stream games nintendo and Sony are doing very well console sale wise only one struggling is xbox unfortunately

@Battlefieldmedic I don't think Xbox is struggling. I think they're just trying different things, attempting to evolve gaming.

@HonestHick I'd argue that the problem is that casuals aren't really on console to begin with. The casuals are on PC and mobile with the console playerbase being something between hard-core and casual. A big reason we're even having this discussion is because consoles never really took off with casuals and general audiences. The best selling individual console is at 160 million units (and it's the PS2 whose lifecycle ended well over a decade ago). Mobile is where most people game casually and even PC has more users. It's the difference of each individual console having sub 200 million active users (I'll be generous and say 500 million total) and mobile and PC being in the billions. Cloud isn't targeting console gamers, it's targeting all the gamers and non gamers who were never going to buy into consoles to play AAA games.

The way I see it, consoles screwed themselves. They went for a business model that fragmented the market (and often times even within their own ecosystem between generations) and painted a very confusing picture for all the non gamers. Consoles built up a loyalist audience early on, but have since been unable to expand beyond that audience with growth having stalled for a long time. It's also gotten to the point where the way they've presented themselves in the past have made it difficult for them to move forward. There's now push back from the fan base that sustains consoles when they try to expand and open up. There are people mad that Sony continued to support PS4 gamers and didn't do like last gen. There are people made about Xbox's expansion strategies (from day one PC to cloud to PS launches). There are people mad that Sony is putting games on PC. There are people mad that third party exclusives are going away. That there is push back from gamers on these things is bonkers to me, but also makes so much sense when fragmentation and hoarding for the privelege of buying XYZ exclusive is all we've been taught in the console market.

It's a real concern as the cost of hardware increases and the cost of game development increases and the customers on a console doesn't nearly as much. Even Nintendo isn't immune to this issue. They just aren't as deeply affected because they control their costs far better and aren't a massive beyond gaming corporation that has to show infinite growth and justify to investors why the gaming divisions should just be sold off and that money reinvested into the departments earning more for investors. Like Nintendo is able to have hardware weaker than the Xbox One & PS4 base models AND continue to out sell the current generation at, not much cheaper prices (not at all cheaper in the case of the series S and even the PS5 digital is approaching the Switch in terms of price). Same goes for their games. They don't spend as much and whip out beloved products at the same price as the rest of the industry that often top charts. Heck, even their utter trash tops charts (every one can hate modern Pokémon games and Nintendo still manages to sell them TWICE at launch now for $60 a piece). But it is a problem they will run into eventually and frankly, eventually they'll have to start asking why they're leaving money on the table.

@ZYDIO Xbox IS struggling to grow but the same can said of the entire console market. It is interesting how we've come to care so much about a company's growth. Like Xbox was pulling in over 10 billion (with a peak around 15 to 16 billion) even before the Zenimax and ABK aquistions. Investors care because they've made an investment and they want to see it grow, but funny how much gamers have come to care in seeing companies pulling in over 10 billion USD have percent increases.

Off that aside, yeah Xbox and all consoles are struggling to grow... which is to say they haven't much at all. Meanwhile costs have been increasing a LOT. Xbox is doing what they frankly should have from the start and leveraging that they are Microsoft a massive software company. It's crazy when you think that Microsoft first party games like Age of Empires weren't on Xbox consoles until THIS GENERATION (literally with MS Flight sim 3 years ago in 2021 as the first). They want an open expansive ecosystem so they can capture revenue on all platforms instead of a fragmented one with fragmented returns.

@MeanBeanEgg You have a very different definition from massive then I do. I'd say consoles are moderately sized. Massive is more on the PC said where there's a billion+ and mobile where there's like 3 billion gamers. That Sony is "on track" to do as good as the PS4 which sold under 120 million sales... well that doesn't sound as good as I think you think it does. Similarly the Nintendo Switch should be hitting milestones of 200 million sales after 8 years, not "on track for 160 million" (and that's really slowing down as we approach the successor model). I'm just saying consoles goal post shouldn't STILL be the PS2 from over a decade ago. That should've been surpassed a long time ago. I don't think they're going anywhere myself because console gamers are really valuable and spending by each gamer has only increased. The platforms pull in a massive amount of money, but they have far from a massive user base. Or at least if we're calling them massive, then we'd need a far bigger word for PC and mobile.

I think that the entire console market is very challenging going forward. In the end the deciding factor will tend to be profitability over console sales. Xbox is in 3rd place for console sales but they are profitable and have room to grow. Playstation and Nintendo are at the top but are struggling to get any more growth. Nintendo has been very successful with the switch but just look back at their failures. The N64 was a very impressive console when it was released and was very capable, but it sales were bad. The WiiU improved on many of the problems with the Wii, but it didn't make enough money so it was dumped in favour of the switch. All of Nintendo previous handheld have been reasonably successful but they wanted to merge the two lines with the switch. Playstation has been very successful but I personally feel that Sony is turning into Sega when it comes to their consoles. The original reason why I started playing on the ps1 was the unique RPG/JRPG that were available. Now more and more of these games are available on Xbox consoles so I have less reason to play on my Playstation. Most RPG/JRPG are the bread and butter of console games. They may or may not have great sales but they often bring in new gamers, and that is what grows console sales.

@Battlefieldmedic not to be rude or disconcerting. But casuals are on consoles. Always have been. They aren’t buying PC’s and playing on mobile. I think everyone can agree most of FIFA’s and Madden’s etc etc are on console and why not, it’s the “best” place to play. Check the charts. You don’t have to be in first to make money.

@MeanBeanEgg the CONSOLE market is alive and well. But who has the games that monthly, weekly and daily make money? MS!! Does horizon make the cash of a Minecraft? Skins on COD and WOW alone make more profit than god of war. Look beyond what the YouTubers and lesser paid “journalists” preach. It will open eyes to who’s doing what.

@Battlefieldmedic if they only sell 10 million or less. At 30 million plus and making money on every PC and PS unit sold they are SAFE. Hope that don’t hurt.

Next 30 years? Bro, we don’t even know the next five years. PlayStation also just launched a stinker of an interim console, unless it wasn’t actually intended to sell. In which case it’s a success.

@jesse_dylan $700 for a console that had reviews that the base console runs some game better is a joke. Those devs are putting out quick patches to get that tag. In time could it be a shade better? Sure but not what some have claimed. It’s not a PC with that soft CPU.

@HonestHick it was maybe intended for enthusiasts only, and not intended to sell a ton. But even on that front it’s not exactly a success, including reasons you mentioned. I’m happy to have no fomo over that one. 😝

@HonestHick the amount WoW makes on transmogs and mounts is disgusting, they recently dropped a $90 mount. Its predatory fomo at its worst imo, but it will sell and it will generate them plenty of cash in the long run.

The only hope I had for the buyout was that we would see less transactions in the game but its safe to say I was pretty naive there.

Love seeing certain users glee at this nonsense of consoles dying off because their favourite brand didn't take off.

Consoles are relevant because not everyone wants to go through the hassle of building a gaming PC or keeping up with maintenance for one, Cloud isn't a viable option yet to be the sole way to experience games and mobile gaming is still met with division from the gaming community outside of Asia.

There will always be a market for consoles, shame that Layden decides to fuel fanboy nonsense.

@MeanBeanEgg yeah I often wonder how the stats can even be presented for PC. Like, the amount of people that own a PC is huge, but the amount that own one capable of AAA gaming must be somewhere on par with Xbox series sales.

There's supposedly c.130m steam users, but I'd be interested to know what percentage of those users can run anything more technically demanding than super meat boy.

I think the three biggest issues that consoles are facing are Cloud, incremental improvements and cost.

For some, and that number will only increase as time moves on as Cloud and internet speeds improves, Cloud will be the only thing they game on, and thus people will have no need of a console.

Then you have the improvements in consoles. There were huge leaps in what consoles could do during the early days of PlayStation and Xbox, but that leap was considerably smaller between the Xbox One X and the Series, for example , and it would largely be possible to continue gaming to a perfectly decent standard on a One X even today. That technological leap was not that great, and you only have to look at the Pro, as compared to the base model PS5 to see that the improvements, whilst there, are not game changing. Thus it is difficult to see how much more Sony or Microsoft can squeeze out of the next generation consoles whilst keeping the cost down. It all comes down to cost. Both companies could easily improve on their consoles, but that would come at a cost that many would baulk at...

Data shows that consoles are mostly popular for people 30+. Gen z and alpha play on mobile and recently there has been a big PC growth trend.
Definitely they will exist before cloud.
Now about the MS strategy - Sure, I understand what they are trying to do, it makes sense down the road BUT today cloud is just not there yet. Thats why “this is an xbox” campaign is simply misleading. They have to push consoles for another decade or two. Well I am glad next gen box is confirmed but I would prefer some marketing $ to be spend on xbox consoles too.
In the end of the day, if xbox console exist and have something to offer that competition does not have - I am in.

@WildConcept6 good point. Consoles went from its own unique hardware, its own media-type (different cartridges), its own games, controllers and features to a very unified device which is basically a PC with its own OS.
For example spider man 2 on PC and PS2 back in a day were 2 different games.
Today same game is releasing on PC, 2 generations of PS/xbox including PRO versions and series s, nintendo switch or its successor, sometimes even mobile and also cloud streaming.
So the idea of closed system with its own fanbase is fading away.
So I actually think MS is very future looking and laying ground for what comes in next decade BUT I feel like they are too early to stop advertise consoles. They are selling us future today that the framework is not ready yet (cloud is still bad, GP is not everywhere, play anywhere program is not ready, etc).

@HonestHick Well said my friend. The unfortunate future we both know we're heading towards.

The next gen of consoles is likely to be the last for me and the industry. Whether interest, finances or death - I'm fairly sure I'll be happy to see dedicated hardware disappear.

@MeanBeanEgg
There are over 2 Billion gamers planet wide. That means with 110 mln gamers PS has 5.5% of the total market of people who play games on devices. With AAA games getting more and more expensive to create it becomes imperative that they target the broader market of gamers. Otherwise, their profit margins per game will be less than Microsoft and shareholders will start to ask why can't they get to Microsoft margins. Nothing is about the right or advantageous thing to do. Everything evolves around shareholders and money the shareholders make.

Sony and Microsoft are starting to take their “customers” for granted. I would love to see a new company enter the market that will make a new console and AAA games. Valve are most likely. A Chinese brand could, but nobody would trust their censorship regime for approving games.