When will this madness end, eh?!
The Call of Duty back-and-forth between Microsoft and Sony has continued lately, with the UK's Competition and Markets Authority publishing a report (thanks VGC) revealing that Sony is concerned that even if the series remains on PlayStation well into the future, it still believes people will be influenced by "exclusive features" on Xbox.
As a result, Sony says that these factors are likely to determine which console consumers buy:
“SIE told the CMA that, even if CoD games remained available on PlayStation following the Merger, the Merged Entity would still be able to engage in partial foreclosure by increasing the differentiation between the versions of CoD available on Xbox and on PlayStation."
“According to SIE, gamers may expect that CoD on Xbox will include extra content and enhanced interoperability with the console hardware, in addition to any benefits from membership in XGP. SIE submitted that these factors are likely to influence gamers’ choice of console.”
Of course, Sony is well aware of what exclusivity can do for Call of Duty, as PlayStation owners have been treated to a variety of exclusive content for the series over the past few years, even in the case of the upcoming Modern Warfare 2.
On the Microsoft side of things, it feels like the company is really getting fed up of these Call of Duty-specific concerns, telling the CMA that Sony has been "significantly exaggerat[ing] the importance of Call of Duty". Microsoft appears to believe that the CMA's decision to proceed with a Phase 2 investigation has been brought about primarily by Sony's critical statements over the past couple of months, which it has described as "self-serving":
“In short, Sony is not vulnerable to a hypothetical foreclosure strategy, and the Referral Decision incorrectly relies on self-serving statements by Sony which significantly exaggerate the importance of Call of Duty to it and neglect to account for Sony’s clear ability to competitively respond."
“While Sony may not welcome increased competition, it has the ability to adapt and compete. Gamers will ultimately benefit from this increased competition and choice.”
The drama continues, then. Even though Microsoft has revealed its displeasure with the CMA's investigation, the deadline for its completion is March 2023, so we could be waiting a long time yet until we get a proper conclusion.
Here are some more of Microsoft's comments in relation to Sony's Call of Duty concerns:
"Should any consumers decide to switch from a gaming platform that does not give them a choice as to how to pay for new games (PlayStation) to one that does (Xbox), then that is the sort of consumer switching behavior that the CMA should consider welfare enhancing and indeed encourage. It is not something that the CMA should be trying to prevent."
What are your thoughts on this? Let us know down in the comments below.
[source videogameschronicle.com]
Comments 75
“According to SIE, gamers may expect that CoD on Xbox will include extra content“
Erm…. But it’s okay for Sony to have done that? 🤣
The Switch is doing just fine without a single CoD. Sony needs to stop crying and start releasing games for their 2 year old gameless console
So Microsoft are saying without call of duty sony have the ability to competitively respond, yet also say they don't have any plans to remove call of duty from playstation. So why would sony need to competitively respond?
Its two arguments that contradict each other.
@Carck "start releasing games for their 2 year old gameless console"
Please tell me your joking.
Since the start of the current gen, playstation has released more first party games than xbox, has more third party exclusives than xbox, and hasn't gone 12 months (potentially 16) without releasing a new first party AAA release.....
@UltimateOtaku91 The comments about "competitively responding" are more in relation to the overall Activision Blizzard acquisition I believe.
They're just saying that Sony is using Call of Duty as a means to overexaggerate and cause a fuss.
Oh no, people would be influenced by some extras exclusive to the IP owners platform, please, save us from a competitive world where anyone but Sony can secure platform exclusive features!!!
Seriously, they are making Xbox case for them, imo. Being the market leader, Sony finds it way easier to secure these deals, and they don’t want anyone else to get such an advantage. They want to use their dominance to prevent anyone else from closing the gap. THAT is textbook anticompetitive behavior.
@Tharsman Sony complaining about that, while they’re actively in a contract that does just that with the same game on their console, is one of the funniest things I’ve seen in gaming for a long time.
@UltimateOtaku91
Where the hard hitters at? It’s 2 years in, nothing to show.
If you say Ratchet and Clank imma scream
This is just getting stupid now. Sony has long relied on platform exclusive content in third party games to drive sales without anyone uttering a word. Hell, just look at that upcoming Hogwarts game! Gimping what the competition has access to through underhanded deals is how they've always remained on top.
They can't seriously expect Microsoft won't give preferential treatment to consumers who play the versions on their own hardware.
@Carck Babylon's Fall lmfao
@Carck What, WeBelieveInGenerations PS4 games are not enough for your PS5? Then feast your eyes on that awesome lineup of Remakes, Remasters and Directors cuts!!!
Regardless of how you feel about this whole ordeal it's pretty difficult to argue that COD isn't significant. Playstation makes a **** load of money off of COD. There's a reason the rest of Activision's games aren't being brought up ever in these talks. That doesn't mean that those other IPs are bad or anything but they just dwarfed by the importance of COD financially.
There's hypocrisy, half-truths, and outright lies coming out of both companies over this whole thing but that's just...you know...business. COD being very significant however is undeniable.
I love this bit
Should any consumers decide to switch from a gaming platform that does not give them a choice as to how to pay for new games (PlayStation) to one that does (Xbox), then that is the sort of consumer switching behavior that the CMA should consider welfare enhancing and indeed encourage. It is not something that the CMA should be trying to prevent.”
So true it's the consumers choice
Remember Jim saying the deal wasnt good enough ? It was they were offered feature and content parity for 3 years and they said noooooo not good enough
This is really childish of Sony
So Sony are allowing Xbox players to play spider-man games and play spider-man in the avengers game?
Oh they aren't? Can we all say hypocrites?
Any Xbox destiny player over the years will have quite a bit to say about how Sony locked many things to Playstation.
Sony are such hypocrites.
So call of duty will still be on playstation...but playstation are moaning that there might be extra bits here and there on the Xbox version.....the exact thing playstation have been paying for years to keep away from the Xbox version....wow the stupidity and hypocrisy
Wonder if there's gonna be an interval review at the CMA with people's relationship with Jimbo as they are looking bad with their decision here. Clearly looking at protecting the market leaders position based on the market leaders word. Definitely no due diligence done before making their statements.
As a consumer that owns both a ps5 and an Xbox series X I want this deal to go through as the value proposition to me is huge. I haven't played a call of duty campaign for years because I can't justify the £60-70 yearly asking price. Sony charge £70 for every new release, including exclusive titles. Gamepass is a considerably better value proposition for me. If I can play every call of duty campaign for the price of a gamepass subscription, not to mention upcoming bethesda games including starfield and elder Scrolls - I'm clearly winning. I will continue to win until Sony either offer a direct competitor that rivals the value of gamepass, Sony substantially reduce the cost of their games or monthly subscription costs to gamepass exceed £70 per month.
Af course Sony have to try to oppose the deal, but now it starts to getting hilarious...
Removed - trolling/baiting
@UltimateOtaku91 What 'new' games?
The majority seem to be remakes/remasters of 'old' games with a few PS4 games that were 'delayed' as they ended up being cross gen releases so also got a PS5 release.
Spider-Man Miles Morales - a DLC to Spider-man that ended up as a stand-alone, Demon Souls - an old game remade, R&C - a short R&C experience but at least 'new', Returnal - wasn't 1st party at the time but joined Sony after, Horizon: Forbidden West, GT7 and God of War all started as PS4 games that took long enough to make to be cross gen releases. Am I forgetting any? The rest (Last of Us Pt 1, Ghost of Tsushima, Last of Us pt2 etc were 'old' games - not 'new'. Have I forgotten any 'first party 'new' releases over the past 2yrs??
Now I know that the PS4/PS5 cross gen releases are still 'new' games made by first party studio's and released exclusively on PS hardware and still count - so I did include those, but I cannot include re-releasing 'old' games that are essentially identical (or worse in terms of content) to the older games - just with Graphical boosts. It doesn't change the story, the game-play etc and if you played it before, you know what's coming 'next', how the story evolves, what happens etc. So I don't count those as 'New' when I have already played and experienced these before.
Its not a 'criticism' at all - its been a difficult few years across the industry in terms of delivering 'new' games consistently without delays and with games taking longer and longer to make, it perhaps helps Sony to bulk out their line-up with re-releasing older games they can tart up a bit - especially as those games were well received when they released before. But I don't think Sony have been 'that' prolific from their OWN studio's over the past few years...
I am predominantly a PlayStation gamer myself, and even though I am not in favour of Microsoft’s deal to buy Activision, because I do think it will effect the industry negatively, I wish Jim Ryan would just shut up and focus Sonys attention at rekindling the Killzone franchise and perhaps trying to make a worthy competitor to the COD series. After all , that would be mutually beneficial for Xbox and PlayStation gamers, and would make for better gaming experiences in the long run for both sets of fans.. Believe you me also, Sony fans are as sick as Xbox fans when it comes to Ryan. All this negativity is doing more damage than the acquisition at this point..
OMG Sony JUST STFU ALREADY!!!
They are literally, repeatedly arguing against their OWN business model that critics have complained about for years! And they're arguing about the detrimental effect a competitor doing that will have against them surrounding a game they currently have a contract with to do exactly that against said competitor! This can NOT get any more absurd! Sony is now jumping up and down screaming out about how anti-competitive PlayStation's business method's are when used against them on the grounds that it will defeat their status quo curated monopoly. And regulators are actually LISTENING to them!
It takes brass ones to get in front of a court and argue that interfering with your anti-competitive monopoly should be regulated as anti-competitive behavior.
Cryin Jim Ryan..
While watching Thursday Night Football (US), I saw an ad for COD on PS and laughed hysterically because of this ongoing saga.
Also, Nintendo has gotten on fine without COD. Maybe Sony should focus on making more games if they want to "compete." Which is laughable that they pretend cannot happen, since they are often the market leader.
Sony already pays for exclusives in multiplat games and they are mad that MS can (not will, but can)mandate the same? Where was that energy when Avengers got spiderman or other games got exclusives on PS? It’s not like MS is going to make the PS versions have less guns or something game breaking. I have only my shareholder hat in this race but I am so ready for this drama to be over.
Didn’t Sony pay for exclusives to this game? The exact concerns they pushing are from their playbook.
@Ryu_Niiyama Spider-Man is a weird thing man. Sony has rights to the movies, Marvel owns the franchise, but Sony’s agreement is pretty tangled
NPR Money did a great podcast about it. Google it. It explains the weird web that’s cast, pun intended!
Good God crying Ryan’s stupid pathetic arrogant aggressive manipulative hypocrisy knows NO bounds! The CMA need to get some brain cells and fast, but as it’s the Civil Service I doubt it. If they can’t see through the sheer hypocrisy from Sony they are even bigger idiots then I first thought considering the buyouts they’ve approved before.
The CMA should pay close attention to the Brazilian regulators words, and follow what they said.
@UltimateOtaku91 how do you figure 16? Or even 12? Halo launched in december, grounded in sept, if you don't count that pentiment is next month.
Removed - inappropriate
Jim "Cryin, flyin, lyin" Ryan needs to shut up and get back to competing and stop crying like an insolent child. You are embarrassing yourself and your brand. Grow up.
Arrogant Sony is back in full swing.
So Sony doesn't want Xbox to have exclusive content or perks?
Ie what they have now on PS4/5?
And they are worried the game would take advantage of the better hardware compared to PS5?
Sony need to get rid of Jim Ryan. The damage he has done to the brand is laughable.
Nothing like playing the victim while sitting on the throne from Sony. "Oh no! This move would benefit Microsoft and hurt us!!??!?!" Well no shizz Sherlock! Why wouldn't Microsoft do a move that makes them more competitive? That's the entire point! Just can't believe how dumb these people are that are delaying ruling on this. That, or they are just power tripping and enjoy flexing on big corps.
@Cherip-the-Ripper halo infinite was xbox's last AAA first party release last November, their next one is in spring 2023 with forza motorsport. The pentiment is an indie and grounded has been out for a couple of years already.
Lots of comments from both sides on the issue. The fact of the matter is Jim Ryan is a cry baby hypocrite. He is anti-gamer/consumer and wants to milk the PS customer out of as much money as possibly. Losing the exclusive content advantage on COD is all about the billions not going into Sony's coffers. The behind the scenes sneaky deals to keep content and games off other platforms, timed exclusives, upcharges for remasters of games, new games costing a whopping $70 and increasing the price of the console just add to this notion, among many other things.
What perplexes me is why so many loyal PS fans buy into this nonsense. "What Sony does is different because Sony buys the smaller studios and cultivates, grooms and loves them. Microsoft just wants to buy everyone because they are a trillion dollar company and this acquisition is different because it is huge. They have no games and that is the reason why they are buying everyone. It is not fair. It is not good for gaming."
The Sony arrogance is just unbearable. Let's face it. Microsoft has a vision and is on the cusp of revolutionizing gaming. Sony and Jimbo are complaining because they have to work harder now instead of using their position as market leader to manipulate their sheep. And I say this as a person lucky enough to own all three consoles. All three are great in their own ways.
Gotta agree with @UltimateOtaku91 there. Microsoft needs to pull their fingers out of their *** and start actually releasing games. Lots of studio acquisitions and not much to show for since. I actually ditched games pass last year, didn't change my life and when I see what's coming to games pass I feel that the value has diminished even more since then.
@cburg The fans are the part I understand least. If you're a PS customer right now, you are not valued as a customer, and Jim's leadership has made that exceedingly clear. You're a cog in their machine toward enhanced quarterly reports. They don't value your business, they expect it, and they expect you to pay more for less.
Anything that puts the screws to Sony and lights a fire under their rear ends is the best possible thing that could happen to any PS fan right now because current complacent, greedy, ungrateful Sony is an unpleasant company to be doing business with. And they aren't going to change that unless they're forced to. PS fans should be cheering this all on at the front lines even before XB fans IMHO. If we can't kick Jim into action, then Phil can do it for us.
@Carck @Tharsman You mean the cross-gen PS5 game God of Four?
@NEStalgia you know what I find extremely baffling? How so many PS fans keep saying Microsoft will just become a monopoly, then increase the cost of gaming and stop innovating and just push the same stuff to us over and over. Because they can’t see Sony, as the market leader, increasing prices and trying to resell them the same games they already own at an even higher price tag just because they slapped “remake” or “directors cut” on the title.
Everything they claim to fear MS will do is what Sony is doing.
Sony produces the best exclusives by far and will continue to do so beyond this generation. I've never bought a PlayStation for COD or any single game for that matter. I did buy a Series X for Flight Simulator though but that's just because I can't afford a powerful PC!
@Tharsman Exactly right! The trouble with fandoms in general is the loyalty to a brand and a concept of an ideology start to become the point of view rather than the actual reality. All of these fans are customers first, and as customers, are getting the short end of the stick from their preferred brand. All of them would benefit from anything that heats up the pressure on PS from outside. But will all argue AGAINST it because it doesn't satisfy the need to be part of Team Winner.
@TJ81 The problem for Sony is MOST PlayStation customers bought a PS for CoD/FIFA/Madden/Fortnite/GTA, NOT for the exclusives. Most customers on video game forums that live video games enough to spend free time talking about video games buy it for exclusives. But most of the actual paying customers are buying for those third party games, and CoD is one of the, if not the biggest. That's why they seem desperate. They are.
@NEStalgia Bruh, I honestly don't know how this has even become a thing. It's like get this sh** done already. Nevermind Jim Cryin Ryan.
Pls review Asterigos instead of this "bite back" stuff.
Sony has become the official "crybully" of the gaming industry.
@TJ81 I couldn't disagree more. As some who had a PS4 since it launched last gen, I was throughly disappointed with both the console and it's exclusives. Despite the video games journalists and awards scene seemingly being in love with their games, they never did anything for me, in fact I quickly got bored with their "video games as cinematic action movies" direction.
@JayJ Fair play. As someone who has been gaming since the late 80's, it was my opinion that the PS4 generation had the strongest exclusives yet but hey, it's just an opinion. I've since been extremely glad to jump on Xbox again too as Gamepass has allowed me to catch up on anything I missed but to mention all the indie gems and forthcoming day one titles.
@JayJ Same here! Sony's exclusives were the most boring ones during the last generation, when I had all the consoles (except Vita). This generation, PS5 is, basically, PS4 rinse & repeat but with anti-consumer practices added to the mix.
This scheme of Xbox is suspicious. He says one thing and does another later.
@Banjo- Yeah it amazed me how people are still such suckers for that brand, but then again that's just the standard fanboyism that I have seen everywhere. It's just for some reason the Sony fan have been the most fanatical and extreme, which I think has been fueled by media bias. Luckily it seems like all the anti-consumer nonsense coming from Sony these days has been making a lot of people question their loyalty to the brand.
LOL well CoD was goi9ng to be on PS until 2027....
LOL Jim Ryan has talked enough ***** that they "innadiquetly" lost any handouts from Xbox on anything going forward...
I'm honestly glad to see Xbox have a little backbone
I mainly play PlayStation but all these comments from Jim Ryan are making me want to switch exclusively to Xbox.
Haven’t Sony paid to keep the final fantasy 7 remakes off Xbox ?
I think many people are (understandably) reading too much into the UK CMA's parroting of Sony's complaints & gripes. Just like Brazil.
Come ruling time, I fully expect them to rule in Xbox's favour and dismiss those gripes publicly too. Just like Brazil.
I missed the fact that the CMA has stated Nintendo is 'NOT' competing with Sony or Microsoft in the gaming marketplace, to quash Microsoft's claims that Nintendo are doing just fine without COD.
So now the CMA are selectively choosing which companies do and don't compete in the market they are meant to be protecting and regulating, to suite theirs and a, 'SELECT', companies arguments.
This stinks of Sony giving some large sum of money to the correct MP.
@Tharsman You needed to highlight the 'Sony 'IS' doing' part. But the loyal fans will still endlessly defend anything Sony does. Like put the price up on the console at the same time as making it cheaper to produce.
@S1ayeR74 Where did you see this about nintendo not being a competitor? I would think the only logic that would support that would be to assume infinite discretional income, which would negate any conflict of choice between ps and xbox. Most people only have so much money to spend and nintendo vs ps vs xbox is a real decision people have to make when considering how to spend their entertainment budget. That makes nintendo competitors by default.
@JayJ "It's just for some reason the Sony fan have been the most fanatical and extreme, which I think has been fueled by media bias."
Exactly, there are users that hang out around here stating as a fact that PS exclusives are objectively better, just because of the media bias back them up. Someone told me to buy The Last of Us as a horror masterpiece and it turned to be a big let-down but, every few weeks, I still read people mention it as a better game than anything that Microsoft has ever published. That or God of War or whatever.
Every time I read something like that on an Xbox site, I have to chime in to remind them that I got a PS4 before an Xbox One and that I enjoyed more Xbox One exclusives than PS4 exclusives.
At least, people that are not blind can admit that Sony is being very hypocritical and anti-consumer lately, regardless of game libraries. Anyway, this reminds me that last year, Xbox Game Studios got better reviews and better score average than PS Studios.
@UltimateOtaku91 Forza Horizon 5 was November. Halo Infinite was December 8th for the Campaign. And how is Pentiment indie? Please explain…. Please please explain that one.
Also Grounded and Deathloop are still first party releases on Xbox. You can thank Sony for that Deathloop delay; because that is literally the game they are playing themselves; and Xbox honoured it.
Not disputing Xbox needing more games because they do but this whole argument is so stupid; especially when Sony is releasing remakes and Director’s cuts at full price to pad out their library; which Xbox chose not to do.
Gears 5 with next-gen upgrade and Hivebusters for £70? Nah
Gears 5 with free next-gen patch, also on Gamepass, Hivebusters for like £15, also included on Gamepass? Yup
@CunningPig @S1ayeR74 The CMA are using official Nintendo comments, Nintendo's been saying for a long time that they're not competing with Sony or Microsoft.
I’m sorry, did Sony just pop off and say “They’re going to be able to do to us what we’ve been doing to them for three generations and that’s not fair”? What the Hell?
@UltimateOtaku91 That's completely false. This baseless 'no games' story is what Sony is afraid to lose. They have barely released anything as well.
@Carck PS5 has numerous PS exclusives! The Last of Us Part 1, Ratchet an Clank, Demon’s Souls, Astro, Spiderman, Miles, Ghost of Tsushima, Gran Turismo 7, Death Stranding, Uncharted 4, Odd World, etc. Xbox Series S/X has 2, Halo 89 and Forza H 57 an Flight Sim which is a PC game.
@sjbsixpack what’s funny is that out of the whole list, the only true PS5 new game you mentioned is Ratchet and Clank.
I will scream.
@sjbsixpack how is Flight Sim a PC game and half of those PS games you mentioned not? Also, pretty sure there are more Ratchet and Clanks than Halo games at this point. Also Oddworld is on Xbox…
@Carck i’ll give him Astro’s Playroom as well. Great little PS5 exclusive.
@Banjo- Yeah some people's love for Sony's games has always confused me, same situation where I always had a PS4 and these critically acclaimed games of theirs just never did anything for me. Meanwhile I always had fun playing games on my Xbox One. Heck last gen was really confusing for me in general, it seemed like the stuff that I didn't care for was really popular with gamers while the stuff that I enjoyed was being unfairly hated on. If anything that just made me really dismissive of the gaming community and the media. I mean if you can't relate to people, why listen to them?
@JayJ Just look at those smart ones coming here yet another day to say that PS exclusives are better and that Xbox games are not exclusive because they're on PC while PS5 games that are also on PS4 and PC are exclusives. They are as hypocritical as Jim Ryan himself.
Look like CMA are Sony fanboys, can we get other, maybe xbox fanboys)
@JayJ TBH I think the PS fanbase has kind of split into two or more different fanbases. There's the classic PS fanbase, which is me, which mostly at this point laments that PS is no longer Japanese, misses the Japanese games, is furious at the closure of Japan Studio, and mostly sticks around for the lingering Japanese devs that still primarily support it.
Then there's the "new" fanbase that mostly started with PS during PS4, thinks the ND "interactive cinema" experience is the best thing ever, don't remember the good old PS1-PS3/Vita days "before TLOU" and a significant number were the obnoxious 360 brown shooter dudebro fanboys before that...
It's that new fanbase that tends to be the obnoxious one, which makes sense, they were obnoxious when they were the 360 fanbase, too.
But I think BOTH fanbases are about to be disappointed in the PS5 gen as they replace both the J-games and the cinematic movie games with GaaS fortnite copy attempts. It won't make everyone suddenly buy an Xbox, but it'll make everyone unhappy and both formerly warring camps will complain together a lot
@Banjo- Yeah I always found the hypocrisy to be frustrating as well, it's why I eventually distanced myself from them.
@NEStalgia Yeah I can agree with that, as I grew up being a big fan of Playstation. Like my first console was a Sega Genesis, and I loved Sega growing up, and I had Sega Channel, the first GamePass-esque service that was way ahead of it's time. It kinda makes sense to me how Sega fell apart around the same time that Xbox entered the scene, because over the years it feels like Xbox has really replaced them.
That said, I remember how much I loved my PS1 growing up, like back in the late 90's there was nothing else quite like it and I was so enthusiastic about it. I also loved the PS2 as well, and I feel like I was a bigger fan of the PS3 than most, heck I was even a fan of the Vita and the PSP before that. The PS4 is where they completely lost me, it feels like they became a completely different company that generation, and by the time it was over I couldn't recognize them anymore. Now I got no interest in a PS5 because it just seems like "more PS4."
@Carck Miles, Gran Turismo 7, Oddworld, Astro, The Last of Us is new, they remade it. Demon’s Souls too. Ghost of Tsushima isn’t exactly old. My point is there are lots of games that can only be played on a Playstation 5. There are 2 that can only be played on Series console. 3 if ya count Flight Sim.
@K1LLEGAL Flight Sim is 100% a PC game. Flight Sim was on PC before Xbox was invented! I’m not talking about console games that eventually come to PC, they are still console games. Flight Dim is 100% a PC game, ya meant to play it with a hotas controller.
@JayJ Sega fell apart because they released 4 consoles in a short period of time, screwed over their partner retailers and developers with the surprise Saturn launch. They probably would have been fine had Sony not come in, subsidized hard (using those deep deep pockets) and undercut them severely every time.
That's why current Sony astounds me. Their empire was built on being CHEAPER than the competition, everything about PS was built around being the best value, being the lowest price, being the cheapest/easiest to develop for. That defined everything about PS1 and 2 and the iconic years. This new "we're a premium luxury product" act just doesn't fit everything that made PS fun. If I wanted a stuffy luxury product I'd buy Apple and have an old Neo Geo. Although they did that with PS3, but PS3 still turned out to be a fun machine.
I do agree with PS4, that echoes my experience perfectly. I'm not sure if the whole mood changed just because Kutaragi left in shame after PS3, or just because they were desperate for survival (which they were after PS3), but I was also not as enamored with the PS4 era as most. The first half was fine launch year was dire, but it picked up after that. But mid-way through it started feeling joyless. That's when Hirai and House were gone, the new suits were in, they were westernizing everything, moving to the blockbuster cinematic focus and losing all the fun stuff they used to have. At least there's Medi-Evil. That and Astro are the one last throwbacks to the good old days.
IMO with the two fandoms that's how you separate the "real" PS fans from the "team winner" (former 360) fans. If you loved PS3, PSP, and Vita, you're a real PS fan. The vocal PS4-era-only fans don't appreciate PS3 and Vita. For them PS started with TLOU.
I'll throw the PS2 era Jak 2 fans in as part of the problem They built the ND fire that ruined everything
@CunningPig I saw some you tubers mention it, I believe it's in the 72 page report the CMA releases somewhere.
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