Xbox Games Are Enjoying A 'Positive Upward Trend' On PS5, Suggests New Analysis

Glad it's working out for Microsoft. The more people playing, the merrier!

It's a shame this isn't a two-way street for Microsoft, but such is life (and it's more money in MS pocket)!

but but xbox has no games how come PlayStation players suddenly want to play them

@trev666 Because they secretly like Microsoft games but either don't want to buy an Xbox to play them, or can only afford one console and chose PlayStation.

Plus, I think a lot of PlayStation gamers are jaded Xbox fans that didn't like decisions made during the X1 era so they jumped ship and are now "locked" into the PlayStation ecosystem (by choice, of course).

It’s good to see PlayStation users enjoying some titles from Microsoft’s game library! I can’t imagine how well Sea of Thieves is going to perform on there, evidenced by the amount of pre-orders it got!

@GamingFan4Lyf You nailed it right on the head! I know that it would seem like buying other consoles to play one specific exclusive is a no brainer for some, but consoles are pretty expensive. Given the time that we live in now where prices on almost everything are taking an increase, some can’t buy other consoles and have to stick to the ones they already have in their possession. Of course, there are some that are able to, but some cannot.

Xbox no longer has exclusives and all of Sony’s games are from Xbox. I’d like to formally congratulate Nintendo for winning the console war.

@VoidPunk

Stellar Blade is out in 2 days and is getting good reviews so no.

@VoidPunk It's a special console operation not a console war in some parts!

It’s good for the games and players but if this ends up becoming a successful strategy you can bet every single Microsoft gaming title will eventually be on PlayStation.

The stats appear to show that Xbox is steadily achieving more success with each PlayStation release

And this is/was the reason behind Microsoft's decision. Hopefully this will lead to more investment for experimental projects and a steady flow of games to GamePass, especially great Indies 👍.

@VoidPunk LOL! They won the console war in a biplane that hasn't left the airstrip in 7 years no less.

@ShadowofTwilight "All Sony's games are from Xbox" is hyperbole but "All Sony's games are from someone other than Sony" isn't. Their studios have been notably absent, and their "exclusives" have been purchased 3rd party for the most part. Which was Matrick's X1 strategy and everyone hated it back then.

@GamingFan4Lyf Yeah, I've long said that the obnoxious X360 dudebro fan is what became the obnoxious pony in the PS4 generation. Shu said at the PS4 launch time that the majority of early PS4 sales were from 360 owners switching, not PS3 owners upgrading. The PS fanbase was the more pleasant of the two during the PS360 gen.

Still, the hypocrisy of "exclusives sell consoles, we need more exclusives" and "I want that other console's exclusives, but refuse to buy the console to play them, so I'll trash them unless I can buy them on the console I have" seems delightfully glib.

That sounds like the expected trend given the titles that released. Pentiment was the least popular on xbox/pc of the 3 and grounded the most popular.

I don't see this as a trend that ps users are becoming more and more welcoming to xbox games. I think grounded is just more accessible and popular than hi fi which was more accessible and popular than pentiment.

@ShadowofTwilight Which is yet another 3rd party title.

I wonder when we will find out what set of games are coming next? Or if there is some kind of window maybe like 12 months exclusive to Xbox and then they start to port titles maybe. Still hope core franchises like Halo, Forza, Fable and Gears stick to Xbox or every one will just buy a PS5-PS6.

@HonestHick I do wonder if that rumoured Gears Collection will see a PS release, would be very surreal though if Gears does hit PS.

@Sifi

I'm struggling to see your point. It's an exclusive PS5 release so why does it matter?

Oh right, Sony didn't buy out the company like a certain other console maker does so it doesn't count.

@NEStalgia

I forgot that doing deals and financing games is only bad when Sony does it. Least they don't have to buyout massive publishers just to tout a win like a certain other company.

@NEStalgia

Exactly, both the Virtual Boy and Wii U had more exclusives.

@ShadowofTwilight Like it or don't, the situation is Microsoft is releasing games but not keeping them exclusive and Sony isn't releasing games at all, they're releasing PC ports and buying exclusivity of other games from other companies. If Microsoft paid for exclusivity Stellar blade instead of Sony you'd be screaming of evil Microsoft.

Void was mocking how all of Xbox games are on PlayStation and all of PlayStations games are from everyone but PlayStation. That's accurate.

@VoidPunk I actually bought them all in both cases, too lol

This is very good news. The better MS does, the better Game Pass will be. It has really single handedly reinvigorated my love for gaming. Just can’t imagine going back to gaming without it.

@DennisReynolds if Gears collection hit’s PS5, and then other major franchises from Xbox hit’s PS5-PS6 it will at the very least take 10-20% of its console player base away. There are a few on this site that i have seen say they would just go PS. So MS has to be very cautious with what they bring over. Unless they just want to go down that rabbit hole all the way of any screen is a Xbox and we don’t like exclusives. Then Sony will sit back and gladly take the revenue and of course market share. I think MS know’s if they do that then they are going 3rd party at some point after. Time will tell but i think Gears stay’s on Xbox and PC. The June showcase can’t get here fast enough.

@NEStalgia

Nope, I'd rather Microsoft did deals and have stated this more than once. The leadership is too inept and opts to consolidate instead.

@HonestHick it will probably depend on review scores and sales/user metrics on pc/xbox before they even consider which games on other platforms. There will be plenty of games that remain exclusive to pc/xbox. I'm guessing they will continue the current trend of highly praised titles that are lower tiers than Starfield/Indiana jones/gears/etc. Avowed and hellblade are probably candidates.

I doubt they ever give a formula for when to expect games. Some games won't go at all and some will be longer exclusive windows. They want the mystery surrounding it.

@BacklogBrad thats a really good take on that Brad. I agree with it. But to play a little devil’s advocate here. Isn’t the mystery surrounding what may or may not come to another console kind of damaging to the brand. We know there are players that will wait on titles if it so means they are coming to PS. Not the other way around. I agree with you 100%, but i think it leaves a dark cloud following the releases and hype of owning or even coming into the Xbox platform. I said it on here a few times but I’ll repeat it. Gears is to Xbox for me what Mario is to Nintendo. I liked my OG Xbox. Granted i only had it for 1.5 years and then the 360 came out and this Gears of War title turned me into such a Xbox fan that my PS3 became exclusives only. So maybe i have my blinders on about Gears but i just think there is to many hardcore Xbox guys around cause of Gears. So to see it on another platform would really hurt the brand.

As for the smaller titles, i see your point on those and agree but as i like to say a lot of little things can add up to something bigger. 1-2 maybe 3 smaller titles won’t move Xbox’s but 6-7 of them will start to add up to at least take notice. If those are just going to go to PS, it’s sort of all for nothing. Maybe i am looking at that wrong. Sony is a ruthless killer in the console market place for so long cause they will do anything to have titles on their platform and not others. Whether they have to pay for them, make them or fund them for timed exclusive deals. We all sit here and say man that is shady and cutthroat. But it keeps them in the eyes of gamers as the place to be. Xbox needs to play a little more hardball with their titles if they want to grow and get those eyes on them in the same way.

Sorry for the long reply. You made an excellent point and worded it perfect. I do agree with ya, but i think the old school Xbox fan in me is still struggling with this new plan. I am in my own way with it so to speak.

@ShadowofTwilight @NEStalgia the back ground story on Stellar Blade was it was suppose to come to PS, Xbox and PC and only be $50 dollars. Sony swooped in to fill their gaps, smartly so. But they charged $70 and took over the marketing rights for it as an exclusive. Sometimes this used to anger me about Sony. But i see it as a company wanting to sell units and be aggressive to fill players with titles instead of having droughts.

I certainly think MS should use its money more to support more titles to Xbox so there isn’t large gaps in releases. Now that they have bought up enough studios i think that will solve that problem. Any PS fan whining about money being thrown around to get titles or hurt the other companies doesn’t know how money and the world work. You either have it or you don’t and MS does. They tend not to use it all the time is the bigger issue while Sony will cut the check and get the game. I can’t fault Sony for that. They aren’t a non profit organization.

@ShadowofTwilight

A little salty huh? Don’t hate the player, hate the game. MS has more money than Sony and there is absolutely nothing wrong with MS using that advantage to their benefit by buying Bethesda and Activision. Some companies are built from the ground up, some are made successful off of acquisitions. There is no rule book saying it must be done one way or the other.

It only becomes a problem when a monopoly is involved, which was absolutely not the case here. Some of you really just need to come to terms with those deals. They were perfectly legal. And acting like one way is good while the other is bad is comical. It’s just business, plain and simple. And it was Sony’s practice of making so many exclusivity deals that got MS to take action on that front. Kinda funny when you stop and think about it.

“Nope, I'd rather Microsoft did deals and have stated this more than once. The leadership is too inept and opts to consolidate instead.”

And this, I assume you are referring to exclusivity deals. It’s not that simple. Exclusivity deals for MS are FAR more expensive than they are for Sony. So MS is at a big disadvantage on that front. That’s not inept leadership. It’s just the reality of the market.

In fact, not making big exclusivity deals in MS’s position is smart leadership. Why play to your weakness by spending significantly more than Sony for exclusivity deals when you can play to your strength of having significantly more cash and just buying studios outright, which gives a steady stream of games to Game Pass without having to worry about exclusivity deals? Makes perfect business sense to me. MS is already making a killing on COD, given how much that IP makes yearly, and is likely seeing nice profits from Fallout recently. It’s a win win owning studios over spending large sums of money for exclusivity on individual titles. If you can’t see that, you don’t have much business sense.

@HonestHick I think the mystery works to their advantage because it makes it hard to leave xbox if you don't know which games will be available outside of xbox or how long the wait will be. And PS5 users will have to know that they will be waiting a year or more and it still might not ever come. It makes the Series S, pc, or even cloud streaming more appealing to them if they are afraid of missing out.

Kind of like how xbox users are always wondering if final fantasy games are going to come to xbox. You can remain only on xbox hoping they eventually come and some do but the better way to ensure you get them would be to find a way to play them somewhere else (steam deck, ps5, pc/laptop etc.)

@HonestHick Interesting background on Steallar Blade, I wasn't aware of that history. That explains a whole heck of a lot, and it puts in grizzly perspective how much of gamer opinion is simply dancing to corporate strings on cue. Nobody has their own opinion they approve of their assigned opinion. That $50 multiplat position sounds like it would have been a perfectly placed game. "rebranding" it as a top $ exclusive has everyone dancing to the tune.

I do think people need to be prepared to see Sony cut back on that spending. SB probably works out well since they probably didn't really pay in very much. But a lot of that money hatting is costing a lot of money but not really securing much in real sales. I'm curious to see how SB's sales really do compared to other recent games. The eye candy will definitely give it a sales boost though, no question. But even Tifa couldn't save Rebirth.

@BacklogBrad i mean that is a good way to look at it for sure. I hope thats the case. Cause if a banger title comes out on Xbox the gamer in me would never wait a year or never to play it. Now i own all 3 consoles so I don’t have that problem. But i wouldn’t want to wait. Just like i am not sure how many PC only gamers will wait a year or longer to play GTA6. Some will pick up a console for it and then get it when it comes to PC. Time will tell but i am hoping for the best versions of Gears, Fable and Perfect dark, those are 3 that have me really excited to see more.

@NEStalgia Sony has long lost lot’s of money on deals like this one but i agree this one pays off. Especially with the extra $20 a copy Sony lured them into. The game is getting mid reviews tho. IGN a 7 and many others around that 70% mark. So it’s not as if this is getting 9’s every where and making it a must play. Same with the other titles this year for Sony. Now of them are holy crap thats great. I’m more looking forward to seeing if that Astro Bot game rumor for this year is true or not. The PS5 Astro game is amazing.

@HonestHick Interesting, I was seeing on the Push thread the scores were in the 80's on Metacritic, but 7's sound more like the descriptions in the reviews.

IDK if it's a good thing or a bad thing when a game that's set to be a budget title, and a good one at that is then turned into a premium title through the power of marketing alone. It puts an unfair perspective on the game because at $70 it costs more than Neir Automata but isn't nearly the game that is. But apparently wasn't actually meant to be.

I technically like the mid-tier titles, usually better than the AAA titles....but I don't want to pay AAA prices for mid-tier games. I don't want to pay AAA prices for AAA games, the pricing is out of step with the medium.

@NEStalgia yeah pricing is an issue with a lot of games. But this one flat out isn’t a $70 dollar game. But Sony will be Sony and squeeze those dollars. Especially cause they don’t have many games coming in this price range for the rest of the year. I still think the $70 dollar game increase hurt a lot of games this gen. Sony fans might not admit it or say GP players don’t buy games. But lots of players just won’t do $70 for multiple titles a year.

I think it's a fair Microsoft strategy.

In terms of people that don't have money for 2 consoles I totally get that (console wars nonsense aside). Some people may have been prior Xbox owners but the Xbox One period burned them. For me I got an Xbox One at launch and still on and off played it. Sunset Overdrive, ReCore, Forza Motorsport 5, but since I've used it more than I did years ago. A few third parties but still barely used. Ryse barely played, retry-ed still barely played (don't like God of War 2018 for the same camera angle/details in it).

Price and marketing I think did well here.

That and Hi Fi Rush I myself see as yes similar to No Straight Roads but besides being a great cartoony/hack n slash with rhythm like that game has fair personality but I don't think of it as AA type. Sure it may not be as over the top as a Bayonetta/Devil May Cry but I think it stands out.

Pentiment has it's appeal of a

My guess is more so the platforms people are happy with/2 consoles and one getting less used. I won't deny yes with Xbox One/Series X I have used an Xbox the least amount of times then I have an OG Xbox or 360 but besides blu-rays or back compatability yes I am using my Xbox One but so little. I haven't other than Project Cars 3 or Demon Turf aka smart delivery titles and one being an Indie platformer only physical on Xbox as a means for me to care about the platform even though I'd like to.

I haven't touched any of these 3 games like at all. I won't either because I'm just too busy with other games and even then while I appreciate them, they aren't much my thing.

1 being they aren't easy physical, 2 being I have so much else to play.

3.I am not against old games presented as new but I think it was the marketing/timing that made them stand out. There is others out there with similar ideas I'd rather play too.

To me if State of Decay 3 or 2 came out on PS5/Switch then sure I'd think they'd sell well too. They aren't worse then a Last of Us or Days Gone. To me Last of Us is overrated it wasn't my type of game.

But to me even new wise nothing is compelling me this year other than what Another Code Recollections I am taking my time with and because of the Indie Showcase from Nintendo Steam World Heist 2.

I'm full of old games right now or 2022/2023 games I haven't finished. I may consider Front Mission 2nd Remake but I just got the 1st and I'm not THAT into them for the Square tactics remakes really they are 'fine'. Even then I have Disgaea 7 to buy the demo was fine. Or Rain Code as well.

In terms of games with appeal in this case I think these definitely had appeal it's just they prior were on 1 platform, it was timing and marketing them more to be noticed by people.

So console warriors can say this and that loyalty nonsense but I think for the wider audience that has no care about that it's just they couldn't.

There is only so much that appeals to people that buy one platform for something else then these games later.

Me I haven't touched them on either platform but I still think they had appeal.

So in some cases some people are full of themselves and in other cases it's people have 1 console they can't afford more.

In terms of Gamepass, phone, PC, Xbox sure there is many ways they could play them for sure if they wanted to and weren't lazy to but some people are.

Grounded and Sea of Thieves being live service sure but Grounded is a such a good idea for a survival game I think, rather than it mostly being applied to other games like a licensed Toys Story or Bug's Life or something like Deadly Creatures, Metamorphosis, Mushroom Men as more less human but more insect. I mean Honey I Shrunk the Kids or The Ant Bully are probably the most comparable.

Sea of Thieves has made a name for it's self better than I'd have thought for sure. Not my thing but I see the appeal.

@HonestHick It's the same schtick they did to returnal. Really good game for what it is and they annihilated it's sales potential with the price tag. Can't believe they'd repeat the mistake. Only difference is they laid on the marketing gas until the true believers bought the dream.

I totally agree on the game prices hurting games. What kills me is the people that will defend the increase because "inflation", seemingly unaware of supply, demand, and discretionary income in the face of inflation meaning the price needs to go the opposite direction. Funny how many people seemingly are high earners with lots of spending money and don't seem to understand economics in the slightest. Maybe the need less spending money.

Also it shocks me among those that defend it also boast of buying physical and selling their games.... 🙄

@NEStalgia “Also it shocks me among those that defend it also boast of buying physical and selling their games”

I would like to further add on this great piece. GP don’t make dev’s no money but yet they say things either like I’ll wait until it’s $30 bucks or snag it used. I mean i ain’t here to tell people how to spend their money but at the same time how the heck does that make the dev’s anything more than GP?

I wanted to try Returnal but all these Rouge and battle royal and soul’s games just drive me nuts. Again maybe my age. But i either want to play a fast paced shooter. Story driven game or action RPG. But i do not want to see level 1 over and over and over and over and over. Like i did with Hades.

Someday’s i miss physical i ain’t going to lie. I have been digital on all 3 for a decade now. But i just don’t want to buy a bunch of physical and have the drives taken out and i am stuck with them. Remember when steam allowed studios to let CD keys turn your physical into digital copies? I really think we are nearing that on Xbox and even maybe PS. Your thoughts on that?

@HonestHick The one missing piece of the puzzle is scale. GP is, effectively, the Walmart model. Selling at razor thing margins in enough volume, you eclipse the guy selling high margin low volume eventually. That's how mobile is so big. Sure you only make a buck fifty, but you're making a buck fifty times 1 billion users. That's why the users metrics is so important when MS talks vs Sony talking in unit sales. But, yeah, at the same time, the $30 bucks crowd isn't paying more, and the "I sell my games so buying new at $70 doesn't cost me much" crowd is therefore paying $45 tops (resold so only 1 of 2 sales counts.) But it's worse because their physical copy has up to 40%+ lost to the resaler in wholesale pricing + transportation + manufacturing. So $70 game - $49 ACTUAL sale value if we're generous and say 30% loss. Then resold so $25 in actual sales. And most people aren't buying games every month outside the hardcore. Let's say someone buys 9 games a year this way (ever 1.5 months), that's 225 a year in actual sales revenue. $9 more than a GPU subscriber that buys not one single game or DLC. And without guaranteed renewals to stabilize the financing.

I'd like to blame "kids these days" but I'm pretty sure most of these are the old folks... Kids don't know what a disc is.

Returnal is depressing. It took a game that had incredibly cool one of a kind bullet hell shmup meets shooter, and wasted it on a roguelike. Of course, they were just a little indie studio that made little indie games until Sony decided to publish their little indie game at $70 and not budget on price no matter how poor sales were. That should have been a $30 game without the Sony-added cinematic cutscenes. And it would have been an awesome $30 game.

I agree, I don't quite get the appeal of Roguelikes. I can't stand them. I liked Hades my first pass or two. After beating the boss and finding out it just respawns after you die, I didn't touch it again.

But rogues just feel so cheap to me. Always did. Funny you'd mention Souls, that is the thing that I hate most about souls is, you're right, it's ALMOST a rogue even though it isn't. You don't do "runs" from level 1, but you have to constantly retread ground you've already tread if you die. That is my one pet peeve in gaming, I HATE doing something I've already done. I don't mind punishingly hard bosses, but I mind spending 20 minutes on a boss only to die and have to spend the same 20 minutes again. And I hate it more if I then have to spend the 20 minutes before it retreading the same hallway I get killed on 50% of the time each time. I want to do a task once, successfully accomplish it, and then never see that task again. Not keep repeating it. I'm not a soloist playing Rachmaninoff concertos at Carnegie hall. I don't need to keep rehearsing the 45 minute run until I can do it to perfection without flaw repeatedly night after night. That isn't fun. That's why those people make the big bucks doing that. It's also why they burn out and retire to ensemble work by age 35.

I think MS will have a full revolt if they try to let you turn CD keys into digital since that's exactly what everyone revolted over Matrick for 11 years ago. Well, ok, CHARGING for doing it was the problem. In hindsight though, what were they going to charge, $20 to activate a used game? That wasn't half a bad deal. The problem is the people who bough their games at $60 who want to sell them for $45 now couldn't fund their new games for virtually free, they'd have to charge $15-25 for their used games and actually pay real money. The champions of "paying for their games" ultimately, refused to pay for their games.....there's so much irony there. So instead of paying for a used disc and paying $20 to play it you just pay $18 and play everything you want from a list.

Also a pet peeve of the "Xbox trains people to not pay for games" meme from half the same people that "wait for a Steam sale" or, my favorite "support GoG" (where most things are under $10, half of it's under $5.) I mean if Xbox got rid of Game Pass and charged $2-10 for everything we'd all love paying for our games. I think they'd rather keep Game Pass tho...

Seriously though, I love the idea of turning keys into digital if they're going to get rid of digital, but it is a big optics problem specifically for MS because of Matrick and the X1. There's also the piracy risk because unlike PC games that the discs were DRM'ed by keys and key servers long before digital, console discs still are not. IDK they'd have a way of doing that without the matrick license fee program allowing 100 people to license one disc.

I remember Sony was going to have a program like that for UMDs on PSP to Vita digital BC, and after stalling they ended up cancelling the plan. That hurt Vita. But they couldn't find any way to avoid piracy in doing that.

I'd love to see it but the path of least resistance is probably to offer USB disc drives for the forseeable to placate the physical crowd, not ruffle feathers, and let the physical collection die off naturally by customers not buying increasingly expensive drives to use them. Once consoles go mostly digital the cost of drives is going to skyrocket. That's the last industry really making use of the disc drive. Parts will be scarce. Yeah, UBHD exists, but that's the high end premium HT market. Most people just stream at 4k and are fine. And those high end people will gladly buy a disc player for over a kilobuck even if it's the exact same device as the old $99 walmart player.

@NEStalgia yeah good point on the cd keys to digital. That reminded me of a lot of info i read and long forgot. I do agree that the console makers will just let digital continue to take over and stores not offering physical and say well there’s nothing else we can do for you physical players. Kind of pawn the blame off when Sony and MS both wish they could be all digital now. Disc drives are expensive and not used in barely anything these days. I remember when Apple launched the first Mac without a drive. Then i sat in my first newer truck and it didn’t have a cd disc player. I was like it’s over. Gaming is next. Well…. That is taking its time.

Sony’s UMD’s vs GameCube’s mini disk, who wins worse media?
I’ll go UMD but Nintendo sure didn’t learn from what beat them down the first go around.

Rouge games, Battle Royal and Soul’s games i will repeat get ZERO dollars from me. I like hard games, i normally start out a game on normal and if i like it i go back and beat it on harder settings. I don’t find the fun in starting over at level 1 every time i die. There’s such a thing as modern technology and it’s called check points. I love the dev of Returnal. They made some great smaller titles on PS in the past. But Sony of course want’s all games selling at high sticker price. They have moved into luxury pricing cause they see Apple and Google and others doing it and customers paying it. But gaming is different. Look at the Dual Sense Edge, for what it is they could have charged $150-$160 and sold more of them, not to mention the dang thing never goes on sale like the Elite.

Yes Mobile can sell to so many more users. Consoles will never have a billion plus user base. I still think Apple is going to sit back and control a large chunk alongside google of gaming as mobile continues to get more strong and run higher fidelity games.

Glad it is working out for MS.

@HonestHick UMDs were at least a bad solution to a real problem. GCN minis were a problem to break a solution. Although Sony was pushing Minidisc hard during that time, so maybe Nintendo was trying to follow Sony on that one but messed up. That one was so, so dumb.

Souls at least doesn't restart you at the beginning, but it's such a slog from chekcpoint to checkpoint it may as well do that. I actually liked what I played of Elden Ring in the open world precisely because the checkpointing wasn't nearly as painful as the normal souls games, but the fun collapsed when I got to the first "normal" souls dungeon. Plus, I still say, no matter how "fair" the fights, it's just bad game design to have the game built on the player non stop seeing "you died" screens and throwing them at doomed encounters relentlessly. Originally in Demon's Souls PS3 it was supposed to kind of be a throw back to 8/16 bit games and arcade games, but it got too carried away with an OCD fanbase. IDK how Souls became this benchmark. I remember when the OG came out and it was REALLY divisive with really mixed reviews. I actually chose not to buy it at the time even though I was absolutely starving for a new PS3 RPG, but after reading Amazon and then critcal reviews the game sounded terrible enough to keep with my RPG drought instead. Then somehow it became this gold standard of gaming some time after that. Social media really messed up gaming, I think. A weird echo chamber of people trying to "fit in" happened.

Wait, Google is "luxury"?? I always think of google stuff as "cheap crap."

I'm not sure Sony's chasing Apple with the luxury thing. Sony was Apple before Apple was Apple. They always see themselves as a super premium brand even though they never really have been. Their electronics have always been expensive out of proportion with the industry. It's just that Playstation operated separately and did its own thing until PS4 era when Playstation became the entire profit base of the company. Back when PS1 launched they weren't even going to put the Sony brand on it, and on the final product they downplayed the Sony name everywhere. They didn't want to "taint" the prestige Sony brand with this video game thing they thought would fail. Then look at their cameras. They bought Konika-Minolta, rebranded it as Sony Alpha, and jacked the prices up 65% day one. Overpriced faux luxury is who Sony is, it's just PS used to be spared that treatment, which is how it gained success, and now they're trying to pry the same kind of "success" as their TV and audio divisions out of the PS division.

Back in the 90's I had a Sony factory outlet store I'd go to regularly. This predates PS at all, but follows through the PS2 era. A lot of the store was TVs. Those big console in-cabinet CRT big screen TVs back in those days. Cordless phones (with the extendable metal antenna!), of course VCRs, minidisc, all sorts of stuff. Walkman. Anyway, most of the store was of course refurbs, seconds etc. I kid you not, they'd at most knock 8-10% off factory new price, for a banged around thing in a white refurb box. If you caught it on a 4th of July sidewalk sale you might get something for 20-25% off and that was a "grab it and head for the register" affair. Of course few things sold at those prices. There was a stack of refurb mini-disc players in the corner by the front window. 10% off new price. For refurbs. Mini-disc...the thing nobody would ever buy and only ever sold in Japan. That stack was there for 10 years...it never moved. They never discounted it. Because it says SONY on the lid darnit, in all caps! That stack was still there when the store closed! In the PS3 era! Apple's not half as preening as good old Sony, in fact Sony's tamed a bit, overall, but PS got a bit worse.

All that said, it was good old Sony-marketing-boy Jimbo that turned PS into the same morass as the old Sony electronics. I'm hoping that whoever they get next understands that it's 2024 and Walkman is not a status symbol.

What I really don't get is how MS bungled their marketing in Europe so bad. Sony gets away with what they get away with because they're the only option in their core markets. In the US, Xbox does very well against them. The UK is a weird bubble for reasons where, sure XB did well for a while, but for variety reasons they're all in on PS. But Europe...how did MS screw it up?

This is good news.

The more people playing these different titles, the better.
The rivalry between the two consoles is unnecessary.

Will Forza, Gears, Halo, and Starfield make the jump to PS5?
Will Spiderman swing onto Xbox Series X?

In the end, more choices for gamers can only be good.

I have owned both an Xbox and a PlayStation for the last three generations. Happy to play games on both consoles.

@NEStalgia thats true about Sony being expensive tho. I used to only buy Sony stuff when i was a kid. Cd players, TV’s etc etc and it was always more. Sure they do a lot of their own chips and advancements in some of these. But they are and always have been a large mark up company. Apple is also.

Google sells nice things sometimes, i just throw them in there on name sake. I do think Sony will shoot for making the Pro high end pricing. I just hope it don’t need a stand to lay flat. Like seriously Sony stop with needing a kickstand to lay the console flat.

If Xbox didn’t mess up in Europe the console sales would be more even. Sony still ahead but more even. As it is now Europe is Sony land by a wide margin and i don’t see MS getting it back any time soon.

@HonestHick I never did have a "real" Walkman as a kid. (cue sad piano music.) Hmm. Fisher? RCA? Maybe RCA. Back then American brands still existed... Yeah, and Sony, despite being a bit more of a status symbol in Japan than the West at their peak, actually never did much of their business in Japan, they've always been an export-driven company to the point that their finances collapse whenever there's a strong Yen. Fortunately for them there hasn't been a strong Yen since the 80's.

A lot of fans think Sony's going to come in cheap on the Pro. I still think they'll aim for $700-750, but the wildcard remains that was Jim's strategy, and the thing will either launch during Totoki's interim reign or with a firebrand newcomer. I assume Totoki is old school Sony, but as the money man, I'm not sure if he's of the "be a premium image" mindset like Jim, a brand guy, or a "sell 100 million at any profit, fast" as an earnings-focused mindset. Despite being all-banker of an old school physical goods company, I suspect Totoki and Phil have more in common than Jim and either of them in terms of strategy.

Yeah, it's well documented how XB missed Japan, but it's also largely irrelevant because console in general died in Japan. If the XB handheld is real and Sony doesn't have one though? You might see a sudden XB upshot there. They're all over anything handheld. Even Vita did ok there. Japan didn't leave video games, they just left televisions.

UK is super unique and I didn't realize how much so until that article on the top 10 gaming icons putting Lara over Mario. They basically missed the entire 8-16bit console war period. It "existed" there but was so under the radar that basically most of what we remember of 80's and 90's gaming just never happened there, gaming started with PS1 between '95-'97. "Online" in gaming also started later there, I tend to forget but I remember in my PC gaming days playing Diablo and Quake with a few brits and it was a nightmare because they were still paying per minute for phone use + internet fees so, "online" and "downloads" practically didn't exist until into the '00's either. So in the UK, PS=origin of gaming, and the "core" old school gaming market is younger, it got an older start. Obviously Sega and Nintendo and computer games existed, but the history is just very different for the average gamer. So UK will forever be Sony land.

But yeah, EU otherwise is really the core problem with XB sales. It does great in the US. It's not on the market in a lot of Asia so that doesn't count. It's the #1 in Mexico (que?) But EU, I just don't know how MS dropped the ball on that. Germany has a weird trajectory I also forget about. Violent games were banned, for a long time. I don't remember when they finally allowed sales of violent games in DE, probably a few people around here in DE that remember, but they got a really late start to "current" gaming, and of course Xbox, "Halo! Gears! Ninja Gaiden Black!" didn't exactly have a good start in Germany, lol. I'm sure that factors heavily in overall EU performance. But how they lost the rest of the continent is just plain old marketing failure.

@NEStalgia that’s interesting to learn more about EU gaming trends. Didn’t know most of that. Did know that they love PS over there and that’s fine and all. Just think MS could do better there and needs to try and start something marketing wise to shift a few boxes. My dad liked high end stuff. So it rubbed off on me. We had all Sony TV’s growing up. I then bought around 4-5 of them on my own. Turned to LG and i won’t say i wouldn’t go back to a Sony tv in the future. But it will have to lure me in more ways than it’s a Sony. They do have great color accuracy and lead in motion. But for gaming LG has kind of taken over as the TV to have.

The New CEO of PS will be interesting. Not sure how that is going to go. One thing is for sure he or she better figure out Bungie before that becomes a 3 Billion dollar waste. Destiny is a mess and marathon looks like it could go either way. PS5 Pro in my opinion will be $600 as most of it isn’t using high end tech. It’s stuff that came down in price a lot since 2020 when the base came out. There is simply not enough there to see on screen to justify above say $650 tops. I won’t pay a dollar over $599.99. Not worth it, and with 2 Pro’s now for PS, it begs to question will some users wait on PS6 and just assume there will be a pro in a few years? Whether there will be or not, Sony is setting their users up to wait. Tho most of use Pro buyers are hardcore and won’t wait for the Pro and just buy the 6. But as much as i do like Pro models they tend to muddy the waters a little. MS seems to be right this gen and not make one and start earlier development on its true next gen replacement.

I am not sure a handheld Xbox in Japan would matter cause it’s Xbox. Plus they will just buy Switch 2 over anything. I could see the Xbox handheld doing better than the Xbox console. But not sure thats saying much.

@HonestHick Not only is destiny a mess and marathon 50/50 but it was Bungie that killed the online tlou game that wasted years of nd time. Granted it probably should have been killed but it was Bungie that did it. I don't think it was going to go well but they killed years of work and had at least something to launch

Idk, if Jim were still there I definitely don't see it being merely 600. But he's not... It's just such a waste though. I I do think the waiting will happen next time. Yeah it's the early adopters that buy both, but everyone Else may look and just Wait for the better one. I hope it's the last mid Gen we see. The whole idea is bad. It's a somewhat upgraded GPU and ...... That's about it because it can't break the base spec. And then games need to run on 3080s anyway.

I kind of don't want new generations for a long time because it feels like we just bought all this hardware and have been sitting in on it as a placeholder for 3 years.

Japan is a weird market. It's of course all in on mobile. And Nintendo. But in Japan, the old adage that Nintendo gamers only play Nintendo games still holds true. Third party has a hard time selling on switch and many 3rd parts have better sales on ps than Nintendo despite the low install base. Switch is still largely about children there and mostly Nintendo published games. Adults are mostly mobile, and there's that niche that plays ps. Ps was way more meaningful when they had a handheld. Switch 2 will change things a bit. It depends how powerful switch 2 is vs Xbox handheld if the Xbox handheld runs bigger games better. It may come down to game pass vs no game pass, but I think a handheld Xbox could easily surpass a non handheld ps though. Switch? Never.

@NEStalgia my question to that is do Japanese gamers care about higher spec games enough to make Xbox handheld standout? Yes some do but they have a PS for that. Most don’t and they have a switch for that. Leaving Xbox as the American company they rarely give any attention too.

I am still in slight favor of mid gen consoles (Pro’s) cause the tech we get in a console is 2-3 years at least old then it runs for 7 years. So we are looking at 10 year old tech. At least the Pro bumps it up some for those that choose to want the extra fidelity. But then the question comes in as to how many dev’s take advantage of it since it’s a 80/20 spilt. Unlike PC where it’s you have a better card you can adjust the settings and see what you paid for. Which is much nicer. So for that reason if we don’t see much out of PS5 Pro. Then i hope it’s the last cause while i do appreciate the extra power and am willing to pay for it. What good does it do for me if only 25% of my owned games use it.

Now i do hope if Xbox consoles become more PC, we get a chance to pay for more power on console if we choose too. As for the handheld that won’t be an option and thats ok. I will be just happy with what it gives to me. Also i want to see Xbox get more aggressive with its messaging for GP with COD and others. I think that can take a mere 10% of PS4 COD players away. Only the hardcore know of the value of GP. It’s time for MS to tell the casuals. Cause while it will help the home console. I could see better marketing of GP helping the handheld even more. People on mobile type devices love value and options to more games.

I think it really all depends on what switch 2 is. If Xbox handheld isn't much more powerful and can't really run different kinds of games then no. If switch 2 is weak enough that more ambitious Japanese devs aren't putting all their games on it, then yes. The Nintendo market there still doesn't buy many non Nintendo games or games but promoted directly by Nintendo. It's really it's own market, the Nintendo market.

Now if switch 2 runs everything x handheld does it has no chance. If it offers different games, there's definitely a bigger market for that than for a PS5. Plus Xbox handheld has that unique selling point of being the only handheld with game pass. Other than pc game pass on handheld PCs but that's a different marketing front. Not saying Xbox dominates Japan but it'll move more than 5 consoles a week like it currently does and maybe more than Sony moves which only looks good because Xbox is so bad.

Of course they do love their mobile gatchas there and that'll be the king anyway. Speaking of King....

This is good! More X Box games on PlayStation and more Playstation games on X Box..!! Its time companies worked together as it would benefit them financially to sell on both consoles and hopefully put an end to all the superiority gamers have over a console..

It shouldn't matter what you game on anymore.. Just play on whatever makes you happy.. I personally use my Series X, PS5 and Switch regularly .. Mostly on my PS5 because all my friends are on it daily lol..

As for Grounded.. Ive been having fun with it on PS5.. It was a solid game on X Box just as it is on PS5!

Happy gaming, friends! Enjoy your games!!