Xbox Series X and S consoles have been out in the wild for more than four years at this point, and new data suggests that the pair of consoles are lagging well behind Xbox One's performance at this time last generation.
Now, we must add that this data is coming from Circana — who solely focuses on US sales — but according to their numbers, Xbox Series X|S is 19% behind Xbox One in the region after 52 months on the market.
Although the Xbox One had a tough start to its life, this news should probably come as no surprise at this point. Microsoft continued to push its last generation console with big promotions and price cuts over the years - while also introducing the all-powerful Xbox One X in 2017, of course. It's been a very different story with Xbox Series X and S, particularly recently.
In fact, Microsoft has largely pivoted to pushing Xbox as a software brand - with a strong focus on Game Pass, Xbox Cloud Gaming and recently, multiplatform releases. The team insists that Xbox hardware is still important — backed up by recent reports of multiple consoles coming in 2025 and 2027 — but its focus on Xbox Series X and S specifically is definitely starting to wane at this stage.
What do you think to this percentage difference? Throw us your thoughts on the topic down below.
Comments 108
They don't care about consoles at all, and each game they release on PlayStation that does well will be another nail in that coffin.
Shame. XSX is a brilliant machine, would have expected it to sell better than XBO. But obviously Microsoft has switched strategy and console sales aren't everything anymore.
I'm sure Spencer briefed Nadella on this reality. If they moved to a multi-plat model, console sales would plummet even further.
We all knew this, and I'm sure the Xbox team mapped out forecasts detailing this until their new "PC thinly veiled as an Xbox" generation gets released.
For whatever reason, they see more growth potential on this route.
At this point it would be great if MS would make an announcement about future hardware plans rather than us getting everything from leaks. It'd be nice to know my current digital library on Xbox is going to transfer to whatever is coming next. As it is I'm starting to feel wary of buying games on the platform.
@JoyfulFire this is a very fair point, I thing the long term access to the library is probably a key concern for me and anybody who's been invested for long enough really.
It's such a shame really, the series X is a joyous bit of kit. Doesn't make a sound, sturdy enough that my kids can't break it and plays everything wonderfully. Not to mention GP, MS rewards discounts, love how the controller feels in hand, etc etc.
This gen I have only had my Series X. Last gen I went through 5 Xbox ones. Multiple models of the same gen console surely helped sales figures.
Although the Xbox One had a tough start to its life...
I mean, yes, things were challenging, but they were just as challenging, or indeed maybe more challenging for the PS5, and yet we see another month of it tracking ahead of the PS4. Saying the start was challenging is just making excuses for the console doing poorly, and anyone that thinks it isn't doing poorly is deluding themselves.
It's also worth remembering that the Xbox 360 shifted 84 million consoles, and that by dismal comparison, the Xbox one sold just 58 million consoles. So, when we read that the Series console (which includes a really cheap entry model) is tracking behind the Xbox One, we should rightly be disgruntled with the way things are progressing.
Lastly, lets also remember that the PS3 sold more that 87 million consoles, and the PS4 sold more than 117 million. Now we read that the PS5 is tracking ahead of the PS4, despite that difficult start, and it puts into perspective just how poorly the Series is doing. People can keep making excuses for it, but it's just poor. Simple as that. Anyone that thinks that Microsoft will release another console after the Prime will likely be sorely disappointed...
Unfortunately, I am convinced now that they dont want to sell consoles and see PC as a way out. Funny because it all started as a PC in the console form and now likely to go back to being just a PC with some xbox OS on top of it.
And thats driven not only with (lack of) exclusivity but more that they dont even restock the consoles in big markets like Canada and UK and 0 promotion. Very small xbox sections in the Retailers are also not helping.
I am still unsure if next xbox is just a pc mostly as they would lose GP count (most on consoles today) and GP revenues (free online and cheaper PC GP tier). I would not surprised if they are willing to get a hit into GP anyways but just get over with the consoles.
They still going to produce these PC-xbox hybrids or outsource it to 3rd party manufacturers, but traditional console - I just dont see it anymore.
The way I see it now they are testing waters with this PC-xbox handheld this year and then probably their own PC-xbox under TV and PC-xbox handheld coming next gen. That also solves a parity problem as its now PC where you can play with settings. Again it could be a huge win if everything works and priced correctly but anyways I dont think we will see closed system traditional console like Series X.
@Fiendish-Beaver Anyone that thinks that Microsoft will release another console after the Prime will likely be sorely disappointed...
Remember, utopia awaits...
On topic, I'm not concerned at all. MS is taking a pathway that best suits them and I'm sure it will work out very well for them, and for us. Next gen is going to be a head turner - given the bits we know so far, I firmly believe it's going to be a defining moment for Xbox.
They finally have the game output, and one hell of an impressive one at that, and now they're crafting a new controller, a new handheld, and a new console that's feature rich and the biggest tech-leap seen in a gen jump. I think we're in for a treat.
I firmly believe it's going to be a defining moment for Xbox.
On this we are in agreement, @Kaloudz, though probably not for the same reasons. You think Utopia. I think it will be the last ever Xbox console... 🤣
@Fiendish-Beaver well it's the result of all these moves. They devauled console too much so average person actually doesnt want it.
Basically only up to 2023 or so xbox was going pretty well. Some months even on par with PS. But last 2 years (coincided with the Activision deal - food for thought) they clearly changed strategy and shifted the focus so I bet we will be getting such reports all the time.
Maybe sales will be up with the GTA release but aside from that would be down all the time. Seems like people who wanted it, bought it already. So we can say 30-35M of loyalists and GP fans is the sort of a peak for xbox console.
I am sure next xbox is coming and I am getting convinced more and more that it would be PC-based with all good and bad.
Still not sure if they are ready to get a massive hit to GP subs and GP revenues though - thats literally the only reason to make a trditional box to keep the majority of GP subs and most people on GPU tier as opposed to cheaper PC GP tier. Also GP core wont exist at all (which is good imo lol).
@Fiendish-Beaver I think they dont want to deal with consoles anymore at all. Xbox will live as an ecosystem on PC and cloud.
Pretty sure next gen conversation shifts to PS VS all variations of PC (traditional, xbox branded, steam branded). and nintendo in their own league.
I feel they need to:
Because Xbox is essentially a "ybox." Why buy that when the ps5 plays them better, has more third-party games and exclusives? It's gonna have to be price now.
@Fiendish-Beaver I feel like we should wager this lol!
@Kaloudz i bet next xbox is pc-based. too many things pointing on it. I dont think it will be series X successor as a traditional closed system console
I ditched my Xbox Series X when I got my PC.
As far as Microsoft is concerned…I still have an Xbox. I have GPU until Aug 2026.
My system will probably be “on par” with next generation, too.
@VeganHerpes bigger picture is far worse.
First of all, the pricing you mentioned was already seen mulitple times in US. 350 for SX (black with disc drive) and even $180 for SS 512. It did not help much. People buy what is more popular, what their frinds play, where marketing is better, where brand power is stronger. And we see that most will happily overpay $100 or even more to get PS5 over xbox.
secondly, most reports on sales, constant PC rumours and upcoming handhelds and such point at that MS likely wants to be over with consoles and just doesnt want to even sell existing ones. They see PC and cloud as a replacement now.
@Millionski I'm inclined to agree, and I don't think that that's a bad thing at all. If the next Xbox aligns with PC infrastructure, we're in for more support, more choice, and more besides - especially if (in the case of the handheld) they allow things like Steam etc...
We'll get everything we have now, and more, and I'm not sure why people are against branching out. I think it's a wonderful move. PC has more games, more audience, and more reach. If we tap into that, it's going to be amazing.
They’d sell more if they actually bothered to stock them. The only major UK retailer that has stock of XSX is Very - such low stock availability has been the case for months now. Zero stock guarantees zero sales. It actually starts to make me wonder if they’ve secretly discontinued production in Europe…
@Kaloudz its just very big move for MS as they have been doing consoles for more than 20 yeats. There are still several hundred million of gamers out there who do not want to deal with any form of PC. They want a cheap box, controller and closed proprietary system.
I agree there are a lot of benefits of PC and I am myself excited and open-minded about it.
But there are too many questions and problems:
1) this will be a windows machine with all issues that come with it. Any OS/layer above it will cause even more issues (like today if you install custom HUDs and stuff).
2) MS cant subsidize the cost as they are selling a machine with competitor store fronts like steam (with cheaper games). Price of such PC-xbox could be way higher than traditional console.
3) MS takes a bit hit on game pass. Online will be free so GP core wont exists, revenues would be down to people opting for cheaper PC GP. Again its technically good for players, but they can pass these costs to us in one way or another.
4) Its still unclear how the existing console libraries would be ported as many games are still not avaialbe on PC.
And the bigger problem out there is you can buy any PC you want today, in any form at any price point, you can even buy small pre-built PC and put under TV and connect controller. So MS is trying to enter already very competitive market.
Again not saying they will fail or they are "doomed" but there a lot of concerns and questions about how to pull this off and they are aalmost guaranteed to lose the console-only players. these would be converted to PS clients next gen.
@Real_game_passion global recession means value factor, and xbox has an edge here with GP and series S. Another problem is average player doesnt want another sub.
And let’s not mention Europe.
And I know I’ve said it before the UK really has an Xbox series x stock issue.
Microsoft don’t care, and I see very little point of a next gen Xbox and now they let stock almost run to zero in the UK.
I can’t care anymore I really have tried this year but Microsoft with Xbox consoles have finally ground me down.
I can’t give passion continuously if I get none in return from them.
I will just pick the best big AAA games from Microsoft studios and pay and play on my Pro now. So looking forward to DOOM on Pro.
I have assassins creed shadows to keep me occupied as well.
@JoyfulFire
"At this point it would be great if MS would make an announcement about future hardware plans rather than us getting everything from leaks."
Those are not 'Leaks' they are rumours.
Both Phil Spencer and Sarah Bond have confirmed that a new Xbox is on the way, they are not going to say more about it yet any more than Sony will about the PS6.
@Millionski I totally get the concerns and the pros/cons that come with such a move, but I genuinely think that, with all the right moves MS have been making lately, as well as knowing exactly what's at stake, I don't see them screwing things up now that they've got so much right going for them.
I guess we can only wait and see, but I truly believe that a lot of people are going to have to eat some humble pie in the coming years.
I’m glad I got a Series X as my first XBox.
It will also be my last XBox. MS has given me zero faith in their seriousness about consoles, and I’ll be content giving my money to Sony for the PS6 down the road (assuming they aren’t dumb enough to nix the optical drive in it) and the Switch 2 sooner.
Consoles have never been the main strategy for MS its been PC and software. The whole idea for the original Xbox was to have a beginner friendly introductory PC that could hook up to a tv and play PC games. After all Xbox is just short for Direct X Box.
@Rog-X I don't think the definition matters here. We know what we hear with no official confirmation.
Playstation is in a very different position to Xbox. Their hardware brand is well established, they have just released the pro. I think on the hardware side their users are mostly satisfied and comfortable with the how the land lies.
Xbox however is in a very different place. There's a compelling need now to address the usse base about the details other than the vague promises we've had. If they want to carry that huge gamepass base on console going forward they have more work to do than Sony has to convince me to stick with it.
For a console with 100% fewer exclusives that’s not bad.
I think people underestimate how much can change from generation to generation. Sometimes it's a positive reset (GCN to Wii, Wii U to Switch, OG Xbox to 360, PS3 to PS4) and sometimes it's a negative reset (SNES to N64 to GCN, Wii to Wii U, DS to 3DS, PS2 to PS3, PSP to Vita, 360 to XB1). And I'm just talking about sales, not the quality of the hardware or library. Success one gen doesn't guarantee the same success the next.
It's easy to say 'well, this is how things are now, so that's how it will continue the next gen' but history has shown us otherwise across all 3 first parties. Every new console launch can be a brand new start, for better or worse. Momentum doesn't always carry forward.
I think of it like sports. Just because a team wins a championship one year, doesn't mean they'll do it again the next. And a team in the middle of the pack one season making the right moves can be a contender the next season. Every season is a different animal. Every console gen is a different beast. I'm staying positive about the future of Xbox.
If Xbox can continue to deliver big exciting games on a consistent basis like they seem to be doing these days, I think they'll do much better with the next system. Especially if they can differentiate themselves enough from PlayStation. Right now XSX is basically a PS5 with less games. If the next Xbox has a consistently killer lineup available day 1 on GP and has more PC-like features while STILL being accessible like a console, I think that will sway a lot of people.
Ultimately, I wish success for all 3 console manufacturers and I truly believe the next gen might be the first time all 3 will be firing on all cylinders while each forging their own unique path.
If anything I'm surprised it's not trailing more.
I LOVE the Series X, it's probably my favourite non-Nintendo console to play on but at this rate, I wont be buying an Xbox "prime" or whatever it ends up being called.
They are gonna have to seriously woo me with the "Sony beating features" and if the words 8K have anything to do with that I am out.
@Kaloudz first off, this is not a pop buddy. What right moves have MS made recently because everything looks like missteps to me.
They spent billions to get exclusives but that resulted in them having to go multiplatform.
They've basically killed off interest in their consoles.
Gamepass just isn't growing, even with call of duty. Yes, pc subs went up by 30 percent but revenue only increased by 2%, even after a price increase, meaning they lost a ton of subscribers.
Now that they have games, they can't keep them on their box or they simply don't make enough to justify it.
I just don't see any positives.
@OldGamer999 wait wait wait. You returned your pro. After you got your series x back because your son came to stay after you sold your series x. Now your getting stuff on your pro again.
Hardly surprising when MS have given up on competing in the console space, gamepass is their only selling point and that is in on PC, if you don't card about GP then there is zero reason to pick xbox over PS if you are a gamer who wants access to the most games. Either Phil is a muppet or Satya wants rid of the Xbox. Just when they started to potentially get some exclusives that might have driven sales they give up. And shoot the console business in the head. The next Xbox is DOA. Only the really hard-core fans will pick it up without really thinking about the consequences of it maybe only selling half what the series consoles will sell.
At a certain point 3rd parties will stop supporting it as wasting money on a port will be too risky and PS will mop up a bunch of people who are done supporting a company that does not care if they stay or go
@Wakkawipeout the next system won’t do any better, Infact it will probably be worse.
Handhelds outside of the switch don’t sell (steam deck is less than 5m as example).
Sony is selling and that means generally those people are buying digital games and building up a library, they won’t leave that behind to start a new console (proof being that Cod didn’t increase Xbox sales despite being on gp)
It’s just the unfortunate reality, and the reason MS have gone multi platform.
@Weebleman some people won’t accept any negativity of their favourite brand. Makes discussions hard because everything will be a positive regardless. Some positive is good. No denying that but sometimes it can be to detriment as posters have good knowledge.
No matter what the data is showing.
@Weebleman
Yep I’m Pro upped again. I know I’m crazy.
Glad you keeping track, because even I can’t 🤣🤣🤣
I’m not denial or anything, it’s just that i rather wait for official sources, so what xbox series s/x isn’t selling that well, i’m still getting a next xbox until they stop making them, so keep that negativity out away and don’t ruin other people’s moods
@OldGamer999 either you want to turn back on microsoft, or don’t, you don’t need microsoft’s premission
@dskatter i wouldn’t be surprised the second they go back to focusing on consoles you’re going to be a xbox fan again
i understand the data, but console sales are down for everyone, and microsoft isn’t too concerned so let’s not pretend we know what microsoft is doing, the market have shifted and xbox is more prepared for the future. You don’t have to believe it if you don’t want to, but remember it’s my opinion and if you feel xbox is a lost cause, then believe that, i’m just going to listen to any announcements about xbox from microsoft themselves rather from doom and glooming fans
@donv2135 I…am not an XBox fan. I have a PS5 as my main console, along with my Switch. The Series X was bought to play some BC games and some previous exclusives like Halo and such. I’m glad I did, don’t get me wrong, but there’s just not much incentive to stick with the platform.
I guarantee this is my last XBox, especially with Forza Horizon coming to PS. Horizon 4 and 5 are what let me to keep the series X in the first place…
@Wakkawipeout except these generations dont mean anything anymore. we play same games across all devices these days. At this point most people are already in one team or another and dont want to move. The only share that shrinks is xbox as well MS is trying too hard to achieve this.
@donv2135
Yeah, I get it 😊
@dskatter so why are you here then?
@donv2135 sales down for everyone… article literally says ps5 is up by 7%.
@donv2135 did you read the article? PS5 is ahead of PS4. And watch what happens when GTA is released.
People who want xbox cant freacking buy it as its not restocked in many countries.
@donv2135 …because I own an XBox? Or are people who own multiple consoles not welcome here, regardless of which one they prefer?
I never said I didn’t enjoy the one I have. But definitely going to be a one and done for me, though I’ve picked up quite a few discs for it.
The thing that's going to be really interesting I would say is if Microsoft allows all storefronts to be utlized via the new upcoming Xbox from the PC. That way, a lot of user libraries are effectivly going to come across anyway.
I still believe there is a place for a PC-hybrid console for those that do not want to mess around and have always enjoyed a console in front of a TV. It's just a case of how they sell that as the big picture.
@Millionski i saw it, i’m not just saying that we’re probably taking this too seriously and i’m sure they’re going to get stock worked out, you’re thinking too far ahead
@dskatter I own 2 xbox SX and adore them. Ps5 for exclusives. I wanted to be with xbox next gen but changed my mind. If its a traditional console like series X I see it flopping hard and then issues starts and same talks of closing the division as we have already.
my next gen device is a PC or PS6. Maybe if MS nails the PC-xbox hybrid and it will be best of both worlds at a reasonable price - sure I will happily take it. For now have a lot of doubts. I will defo keep one of my SX as legacy device for backlog.
@Millionski where are these talks are closing the xbox division, seriously link them to me
@donv2135 i never recall this problem in the past several gens across all consoles except COVID scalpers era. The problems persists for months at this point.
@Millionski because if you mean that report from january Microsoft disproved that
@VivaUtd everyone wants this hybrid its just not easy to pull off. and moreover, the closest to achieve this is Valve. On top of that you can get all this functionality today with any PC.
Anyway, all console this and console that. It’s the games that count and the best they can be produced and displayed and performance for me.
Hence my massive passion for the Xbox one x.
What a console.
Now even that has changed with the Pro as Xbox one x and series x was the best performance experience. Now the Pro has that.
Then you add Microsoft putting games on PS5 then Pro becomes the best place to play Xbox games.
Then you think ok UK, I will go buy a console.
Lets go to Game UK no stock, ok Argos no stock, ok Smyths Toys no stock.
But we have Switch and soon Switch 2 and PS5 and Pro in stock.
It makes me so angry and frustrated 😩 with Xbox having no stock and please don’t tell me it’s not deliberate from Microsoft.
So what happens little Amy and Jonny end up with a Switch or PS5.
Xbox consoles become a smaller user base whilst the others grow and game pass then slowly slips away as well.
What sort of trillion dollar company lets this happen.
One that does not care at all about out loved Xbox home consoles.
@OldGamer999 same logic but I actually sold my ps5 pro lol. GP is too good for now and PRO improvements were a joke (at least for me personally).
I got the extra SX on the second floor and oh boy it was almost impossible to get one in Toronto, Canada. Literally in the biggest city I found across all retailers only 1 open box SX white in nearest 20km from me.
Thats just nuts and tells alot how they want to sell consoles.
I plan to enjoy my time with SX and GP all they way till next gen and maybe even will wait with next gen as its anyways gonna be another 3 years of crossgen with same games as usual.
I will keep one XS for legacy and good memories (and backlog) and eventually will move to PC or PS6. If they pull our the PC-xbox hybrid as best of both worlds at a reasonable price - sure, I will get it. But have more faith at Valve here and Steam OS. Honestly, prob will grab the steam machine over anything if it happens.
@Millionski My X is a decent console, and I’ve definitely gotten some use out of it. But now that I’ve dipped my toes into the green side, I’m content with hanging out in the blue and red areas of the pool for future hardware.
At least Sony and Nintendo consistently use industry standard storage in the form of M.2 SSDs and microSD respectively. Having to get an expansion card for my X is annoying, even with a 2 TB external hard drive for my XBone/360 games.
@Millionski I understand that, however a lot of people prefer the console experience and we do not know what features they'll be bringing over and in what form that differentiates the experience. I would never use PC personally. I think Microsoft has been making a lot of ground up with building it's cloud infrastructure up especially with the Series X stock issues. It isn't a excuse, you should be able to get one. However, they're seemingly working on the product in all directions and this isn't the doom and gloom that people are making out.
However, it's also very clear that Microsoft is moving on to a new vision we just do not know what that is. We'll never know, until they actually deliver the details to us so all we're ever going to do is speculate at this point.
@OldGamer999 is this actually frustrating you, you need to get some help honestly,
@OldGamer999 it’s clear the stock issues it making you frustrated because it should be stocked by now, but there’s all sorts of things going on in the world, and there’s boycotts in countries because of the tariffs
And to be honest this is why i don’t too get attached to these companies because everything you see console sales, you get upset and act like microsoft took your house away
@Millionski
You definitely cannot beat GPU for value since the end of 2024 with Indy and COD and so far this year and what is coming.
I am new game only person hardly ever go back to old games, that’s why remasters annoy me.
GPU has started producing lots of new games now and is sensational value, there is no doubt about that.
@donv2135
Sorry the others all have stock in all the stores I mentioned and lots of it.
Yes I got frustrated last week trying to get a work friend an Xbox series x all digital console.
@Millionski You should do that anyway, but if you actually get depressed over it, (not saying you are btw) besides is having fun the main thing
@OldGamer999 see, they’re fixing it, and you shouldn’t get frustrated unless it’s something that genuinely does, like if there’s a outage
@OldGamer999 thats basically what kept me within the ecosystem. I need console on both floors and at some point had ps5 and ps5 pro but the need to buy PS Plus for cloud saves and then re-buy games on full price that will be availabe with GP for "free" (as I prepaid it till 2027 and made money back already) was too much. Couple it with not being impressed with the PRO at all, decision was very on surface.
This gen is SX for me.
Next gen is a big question mark for now but traditional SX successor console would be the least desired option for me.
@Millionski I picked up a pro more for the upcoming games than the patches for the ones we already had. It seems assassins creed shadows is the first to really use it to that extent. DF describe the pro features as a generational difference. Hopefully (hopefully) this is the start of the trend.
@Weebleman first off, this is not a pop buddy
Heyyy! You don't have to point that out brother I'm absolutely cool with folks disagreeing or debating. It'd be a dull place if we all thought and felt the same way <3
Let me articulate (because, as far as I am concerned, the only bad thing about written replies, is that words can often get lost to meaning). When I say Xbox has never been so strong, I'm talking from a consumers standpoint.
Like, for me, right now and for the last year or two, I've never had such a good time playing on the platform. The service is outstanding and the value - such as the games I get to play in return for my investment - is stronger than it's ever been.
Throw in the fact that third party are supporting the platform more now (such as Square Enix) and the first party output is like a practical conveyor belt, I just cant complain.
For someone like me (and I'm not looking for pity) that has seizures and other fun health conditions that get triggered by my seizures, there's nothing more gutting than paying £70 for a game that gives me a seizure, that I then cant play anymore or even return for a refund.
Take Avowed for instance. I really was looking forward to it. I thoroughly enjoyed the three hours I got before I seizured and had to put it down for good. Had it not been for Game Pass, I'd have lost full price and been left with a game that I cant do anything with. It's genuinely sad for me to have to Wikipedia a story rather than enjoy it the way that everyone else does.
Fortunately, and again thanks to Game Pass, I can forget the price tag and move onto something else from the service. As a consumer, that's something I just cant argue with. The console (Series S) had an amazing price tag and runs perfectly.
For me, MS are making great moves and the fact that they have so many first party games on the way, with lots of third party games coming (day one) to the platform and to GP, it's never been a better time to be a fan as far as I am concerned.
That said, I do know that value varies from person to person, but I can only speak from my own experience
@donv2135
They not fixing anything. UK stock is almost non-existent. 3 big major stores with no series x in store or online.
That’s serious stuff really.
@Kaloudz I appreciate you man. I felt obliged to highlight it as most folks instantly think it's a dig.
100% respect and understand your points. Value wise they are untouchable, especially for folks like you.
I think I just struggle with the new direction. It feels like the death of the competition between them and Sony, and that's the thing that really pushed them both to be better.
Then again, maybe I'm just an old drama queen 😂
@Millionski
Don’t get me wrong Sony are money grabbing bitches.
As where Xbox has cloud saves for all the family even if they are not the game pass owner they get it through you if they use your console for free.
Even if you have the top Sony subscription the cloud save is only for you the owner and not for others that use your console. What tight arses Sony are.
@TheGameThrifter I always agree with your posts but I'll just say the very first game released on PS (honestly, even just the month of silence while the rumors swirled) was the coffin sealed shut, every nail pounded in, it dumped in the grave and buried for good. There never was any coming back from that.
Now each game released on PS5 is just a ceremonial handful of dirt being tossed on top of a memory. No more damage can really be done.
Sheep gonna sheep ....I own a gaming laptop, ps5 and several Xbox series consoles.....playstation really isn't anything special to be outselling the Xbox by such a margin ...I mean now that Xbox is basically 3rd party there's a lot bigger argument to say if you are going to get one or the other you might aswell get playstation.....but depends on what you want....cause you obviously are getting all the games Xbox now owns at no extra cost on game pass(if a member) ....which you will have to pay for on playstation
@StylesT
You are spot on its game pass ultimate thats keeps a good few on Xbox consoles. It’s great value.
Without that and with Xbox games going to PS5 and Pro the best place to play there is not much point in an Xbox console.
Game pass is the glue to Xbox consoles.
I get what you are saying, @donv2135, but do you honestly believe that Microsoft will release an official announcement stating that their console sales are abysmal, or that they are selling fewer consoles than they did with the Xbox One, or that Game Pass numbers have stalled or are falling, or that the only reason they are going multiplatform is because they have no option because they simply cannot sell enough games or subscriptions to keep their games exclusive? Do you honestly expect Microsoft to step forward and admit anything negative about their business? Were they to do any of that, they would harm their business, infuriate the loyal fanbase and their investors, and wipe tens of millions, if not billions off their net worth.
Microsoft will never admit that any part of their business is in decline or is failing because to do so is simply going to be very, very bad for business, and despite all the missteps they have taken, Microsoft are still very experienced in the way of business, and know what to, and more importantly, what not to say.
Basically, you can wait as long as you like for some sort of official admission, but I would suggest that you will be waiting for a very, very long time. However, whilst you are waiting, if you look out of your window you will see a pig flying off into the distance... 😉
I see the European sales for Feb 25 have just been released. How can Xbox keep going with just 41K for the whole of Europe for a month.
And they really want to release another home console. I don’t get it. By the time say 2027 hits with possibly another Xbox next gen home console, Xbox consoles will be so irrelevant there is very little cost effectiveness and return on development cost return on investment.
@Fiendish-Beaver
Just read your piece on Microsoft saying nothing bad.
You are so dam spot on sometimes.
That’s why that niggle in my brain says they are saying positive spin things and maybe in 2026 or 2027 they don’t bother with another home console, but currently they have to say it, to keep the spin good.
@Weebleman I appreciate you too matey, for pointing it out thank you!
Yeah it's definitely high in value for me. I remember the last time it happened (for a game I pre-ordered and spent £60 on) and fitted within the first 30 minutes. I went to MS for a refund and couldn't get one because I had simply launched and played the game.
Part of that is on me for not getting the Series X (with the ability to return a disc) but part of that is on MS (or whoever it is that makes the refund decisions) for not being more flexible. I think, is it Steam? that allows you a refund so long as you only play a short while? That would be massively ideal across the board.
So, for me, I just cant grumble. Don't get me wrong though. If time comes to pass and MS sinks the brand, I'll be right here to hold my hands up and say I was wrong
I do agree with you on the competitive side of things though. Competition is, and has always been, what keeps two companies on their toes. Take that away and you have to wonder what comes next? That I will say is something we all need to be mindful of.
Oh and I know man... I'm getting on in the years too :/ patience is no longer something I am friends with lol.
I’m willing to agree if this is does kill the brand, but agree to disagree, and it’s clear i won’t change your mind
@Fakegamer
Might be crazy, but I do own I can assure you of that.
Just paid me £69.99 for assassins creed on PS5 Pro and just finished downloading about 106gb. Tried to start but the count down clock says 2 hours and 7 minutes to play.
So it will 12:00am UK time.
Will be enjoying tomorrow 😊
@Kaloudz ahhhh man, I didn't know about your medical side of things and I'm sorry to hear that. 100% agree that refund policies across the board should be more like steam. Especially when it comes to reasons beyond a simple 'I didn't like it'.
Thanks for taking time to explain your viewpoint. While it differs from mine, I can't disagree with anything you said as to why it fits for you. The fact we are all different just makes the world more interesting. If only others could solve their differences with a conversation eh!
@Weebleman @Kaloudz enjoyed this exchange gentlemen. Between the two of you you covered virtually everything I was going to say about the pros and cons of Xbox . They are doing some things great (steady flow of games, game pass, etc) and others not so great. I am fascinated to see how the next few years play out for Xbox.
@themightyant I agree, Xbox Series X is actually a great console. It should be running circles around X1.
So that's why they said everything is an Xbox after reviewing their own internal numbers! I'd want to protect my job too.
I'm all for the Microsoft Game Studios brand. Let's drop the Xbox branding & keep this super simple with entry level "Microsoft gaming PCs" that are just configured same as consoles so we can pick up and play like a console with the option to go full PC mode. I would buy it! And we'd all keep our favorite IPs and not have to watch our boy get butchered.
@IronMan30 it's my favorite Xbox console and maybe my favorite home console I've owned. It's fast, runs games great, supports my 23+ year old library and I've had 0 issues with the hardware. Runs as good as it did in day one! I also like the current Xbox controllers, too many have mine have nasty drift but still, I like them better than the 360 controller.
@themightyant we're here all week my man, here all week 🙂
Does it really matter?
Xbox hardware doesn't have to sell more than PlayStation.
Xbox hardware doesn't need to sell more than the previous generation.
All it have to do is give a profit directly or indirectly (Games, Game Pass Subscriptions) to Microsoft.
That's all it needs to do to Microsoft keep making Xbox console for years ahead.
Ps.: As of April 2022 Xbox Game Pass had 21 million subscribers on Xbox consoles.
Only spot on sometimes, @OldGamer999? Now I'm offended... 😂
@Kaloudz Holy Crap Kaloudz that was a terrifying comment to read. ( T _ T ). Please be careful. The world would be a sadder place without you in it.
Simply put MS isn’t and never was a creative company. They allowed Apple to eat their lunch in consumer electronics. Sony to trounce them with PS. Couldn’t keep a mobile phone in a world that the mobile phone is arguably the most used device daily around the world. Surface while nicely made don’t sell. Steam is the leader on PC a non public traded company at that. Only 300 people work at Steam and they are all gamers to the core and they own MS store front. I mean outside of Excel and cloud storage what is MS leading and doing well in? It’s insane they worth 3 trillion because the world thinks it’s tied to windows for business when business’s that switch to higher priced Mac’s have shown to save money long term in Mac’s longer hardware life span and little to no money in software repairs and updates to the likes of windows. Sometimes i look at MS and just ask how? How do you be so bad and yet worth so much. I love the Xbox controller, it’s why i game on Xbox. But outside of that they make some bone headed decisions that is just head scratching. 360 had PS on the ropes here in America. They let them off the hook in the dumbest way possible and will not get that user base back. I will still support Xbox as i have over the last 20 years but gosh dang they make it so hard to like anything they are doing.
eduscxbox wrote:
It depends what you want from Xbox. If all you want is games from them, or play on PC, or you only care about their share price then they are in a VERY strong position imo.
But the trouble is if all you care about is playing on console then Microsoft is playing with fire and risking the Xbox (console) legacy. Already we see XSX|S losing out to XBO, what if the next console sells even less? At what point do third party publishers start delaying Xbox ports, or even stop them altogether. We ALREADY see this for a lot of smaller games, and some larger ones. If they struggle to sell 10 million consoles in the first few years that trickle could easily turn into a flood (see WiiU, which third party shunned), which would get outside their control.
While I think this is unlikely, it is POSSIBLE with the strategy they have taken, and the obvious solution to this is to merge PC and Xbox in some way which has a lot of benefits, but also, potentially, some large drawbacks. Either way I am fascinated to see how it plays out, similar to Game Pass it could be a massive disruptor to the status quo.
@Fiendish-Beaver
Well ok then 99.999% of the time 🤣
Honestly I’m shocked people use windows it’s awful I use at work and it gets you to change passwords every 5 minutes random updates in the middle of using it 😡. My iPhone/iPad wipes the floor with it most days 😂. Don’t get me started on the iOS version of the Xbox app but the PlayStation app works flawlessly 🤷🏻♂️. Tbh Sony have had to do next to nothing this gen and still wiped the floor with Microsoft 😮. And don’t get me started on how they ruined rare 😭.
@Weebleman It's cool thanks buddy that's very kind of you to say! I couldn't agree more on the refund policy. It's not just that either - I bought Mafia 2 remastered at full price and could not for the life of me (and still not) get pass the map bug. Meaning that the game is literally broken for me. I did everything - uninstalled, cleared cache, cleared saves etc... but because I'd played it for 90 minutes - they wouldn't refund. It's a practice I hope they rethink in a world that's heavily leaning digital-all and only.
Thank you too for the conversation matey It's refreshing to have a place where people can disagree without it turning to chaos. I really appreciate it bud <3
@themightyant Thanks brother Yeah I'll say I'm in the same boat. I'm genuinely curious as to see where we're sat in a few years time. I think I'm a little more optimistic than a few, but I'm not blind to other people's concerns either - though like I was saying to Weeble, I think a lot of that is reflected in my own experiences lately.
@Utena-mobile Aw thanks that's a lovely thing to say! It's just one of those things sadly. No fix for it so you just gotta deal with the cards you're dealt eh?
@HonestHick Put enough hands in enough high-value cookie jars and you can be a trillionaire, too.
That’s ultimately how Microsoft gained its wealth.
Think about every company out there that uses Windows and Office products. Think about all the service contracts it has for technical support. Azure money is pretty lucrative. Consulting services. Research grants. Government contracts. Joint business ventures. Partnerships with NFL, NBA, NASCAR, etc. The list goes on.
Xbox is a tax write-off at this point.
@eduscxbox unfortunately we dont know where is the cut-off point for when its financially doesnt work for MS in terms of number of consoles sold. 30M is clearly enought to keep going but next xbox if its a traditional console is guaranteed to sell less. GP alone is just not enough for average user.
Xbox console is becoming a platform that basically only have value factor in it and thats assuming you play enough via GP.
Maybe they can get away with one more gen before its only PC/cloud.
Now many reports suggest they want to do a PC-like xbox. Its a gamble but I believe thats better than traditional console that just wont get enough support from MS and 3rd party.
@OldGamer999 I think most of us here just did not beleive many things that were rumored (which is a correct thing to do imo) but I noticed the further discussions went from last febturary business update, the crazier things became.
We went from "just 4 games" to "you dont need an xbox & this is an xbox" campaigns, "no red lines" and constant PC rumours.
Now as I look at things it make sense. They want to be on PC/cloud and dont care about consoels anymore. Period.
these are the facts that happened and how can anyone say they want consoles?
1) Aggressive marketing for "no xbox needed"
2) no restocking in major markets like Europe, US, Canada. Thats after releasing 3 mid-gen revisions (what was the point?)
3) Push to no physical, many retailers shrinking xbox corners and some of them even closing them
4) No exclusives with no red lines. Forza confirmed that. Next gen everything multiplat day 1 with 90% certainty.
5) PC handheld this year with constant rumours for PC-like xbox as early as next gen.
the only argument for traditional xbox console is GP count and GPU revenues. I start to think they are ready to take a hit with GP just so they can ditch consoles. GP is not a priority anymore as they can sell games everywhere.
@Millionski
Have to be honest you summed it up all perfectly really and very well.
I just end up ranting 🤣
I also think the only reason a console is here is for GPU attach rate which is good.
Will they ditch it, I think they might as well, they don’t want to promote consoles or even stock them so if consoles go a lot of GPU goes or it will survive on PC and other devices alone.
And maybe one day on PS and Switch.
@Millionski
Yay finally Smyths toys have some series x for home delivery, disc edition.
My pal is gonna to get one of them and join game pass Ultimate.
If it was not for me checking stock a couple of times a day in major stores it wouldn’t have happened for her or Xbox.
I want some commission now from Xbox 🤣
@OldGamer999 let's say they still do a traditional series SX2 console. It has more power and upgraded controller. Now they suddenly stop "this is xbox" campaign and start "SX2 the best way to play xbox"? Suddenly they have exclusives maybe? Do they have a "next-gen" launch lineup of games not accessible on current gen?
We all know answers are "no" to all likely.
It does not mean it will fail but its guarantted to sell less and we can argue how much less. And high change of having low support from MS and maybe 3rd party. Devs be looking at 120M PS5 and 150M switch sold vs 20M this new xbox?
I honestly think they should go full PC at this point because launching next gen console with 0 framework to push it further (except GP) does not make any sense.
@Millionski
You make total sense and I can’t disagree.
They should come out with that then instead of stringing gamers and people along, about a potential next generation Xbox console.
Thing is we have PCs now so what’s the point of Microsoft making one.
@GamingFan4Lyf i mean i get it, but still. They need to make products people want. I love Xbox but i am certainly not a big MS fan. They got a lot of work to do on Windows and other things before i could recommend their products.
@HonestHick I agree.
I have no real issue with Windows - a lot of people seem to really have a problem with it, but maybe because the only thing I do on my home PC is game and browse the web, I just don’t really “use” Windows to hate it - if that makes sense.
Updates appear few and far between and I rarely see where I have to update upon shutdown or am told I need to reboot for whatever reason. The only driver updates I get are Nvidia drivers - and those are mainly just due to new game releases.
I also don’t necessarily praise Windows either. It’s just…there. Plus, if I want 100% compatibility for games across generations…there isn’t really any other choice.
I wouldn’t recommend Surface products solely because the price is too high for what you get. They aren’t bad, per se, just…expensive.
But, yeah, overall, it doesn’t feel like Microsoft really cares about putting out “great” products anymore as its main business feels more like being in the business rather than generating exciting products.
Don’t get me wrong, the games its put out are fun, but, the gaming part, up until recently, always felt separate from Microsoft proper.
@GamingFan4Lyf Yeah windows for PC gaming is a must. I like windows as a Ui not a Os if that makes sense. Like when issues aren’t in the way of my work laptop i enjoy the layout and use of windows. In some cases i like the way it works better than my personal Mac. But my Mac is so much more faster and reliable and has less clicks to do the same tasks in most cases. MS and Xbox were for sure separate. Now with all the money sent they are one and the same. Which scares me but also means MS wants to be in gaming. Now we just have to see how they can tackle this hardware issue. Cause if they do that, they are well set on software. They are putting out more games now than ever. It’s going to be fun to learn more about their plans.
I also want to save some money aside and built a beast of a PC one day for gaming. Steam is the best thing in gaming and it’s starting to take over. Their numbers are just insane. Funny how 300 people running a non public traded company is ruling gaming. Well done Gabe well done! Haha
@Fiendish-Beaver i understand you genuinely believe xbox is actually going sega, but they’re not just suddenly pull xboxs from shelves
Removed - trolling/baiting
No, I agree, @donv2135. I mean, it's difficult to pull Xboxes off of store shelves, when there are not any on the shelves in the first place... 😉😂
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