Microsoft Says Native Xbox Cloud Gaming App Remains 'Impossible' On Apple Devices

Oh dear what a pity never mind 🤷🧑‍🌾 I bet this is somehow the series s fault I can just feel it 👍

Why’s the percentage so high? Apple are pure absolute greed. There’s nothing else to that.

Apple is way worse than Sony😋

This comment is coming from a place of naivety more than anything but don’t Microsoft get around 30% for third party games sold on the Xbox? I don’t understand the intricacies of Apples policy here but also don’t understand how it’s any different from the platform fees Xbox charge to developers.

So…how much does MS take from each game sold on the XBox?

I think that’s a relevant fact to consider. I genuinely don’t know the answer, but if it approaches 30%…MS has no leg to stand on.

most stores take a 30% cut Sony, Microsoft, apple etc etc

Epic take 12%

All stores take a similar percentage of each sale. Here the problem is that Apple wants to continue taking that percentage for future transactions made in that app after the sale, for example, if the user pays a subscription as Gamepass using the app Apple wants 30%, which makes it unfeasible to have a native Gamepass app.

These types of policies are starting to be seen as abusive in some legislatures, the European Union doesn't like them too much and Apple will probably have to change this in the future.

@GeeEssEff @dskatter It's in the article you are commenting on, "Guideline 3.1.3(b) prevents different content, subscriptions or features (including consumables in multi platform games)"

Basically, Apple is way too greedy, but Apple fans are used to their exclusivity policies. Besides, it doesn't make much sense comparing a video game console like Xbox, PS or Switch with Android and iOS devices. EU doesn't like Apple's policies, for instance, but Nintendo and Sony's reluctance to feature Game Pass is somewhat understandable. Of course, Sony and Nintendo fans will use any excuse to bash Microsoft, though.

@dskatter @GeeEssEff You realize they aren't selling any games on Apple right? 30% of Microsoft's Game Pass subscription revenue just for a native XCloud streaming app when it is predominantly used on the Xbox console by an incredible margin is absurd. Microsoft said they should be charged similar to a Netflix type streaming service, not charged like they are selling an iPhone game... You think Netflix takes a 30% overall revenue hit just to be able to stream on iPhone?

@Banjo- @Trmn8r All I notice is that my question as to how much MS takes off of every XBox console game sale hasn’t been answered.

@dskatter Same as Sony and Nintendo, 30%, but that is for software sale, not a streaming fee. Steam's fees are variable. If you read the article and the quote above, you'll maybe understand why Game Pass on Apple is impossible. If Google did the same, it wouldn't exist on Android devices either. That's the comparison you have to make.

@Banjo- Lol exactly! Apples (pun) to Oranges comparison, comparing sales to streaming app fees. It should be the same/similar rate Netflix or any other streaming service gets and Google understands that.

@Trmn8r Apples to oranges 🤣. Imagine Netflix paying Google 30% of their subscriptions... It wouldn't be profitable at all.

@Trmn8r what do Netflix etc get? Genuinely have no idea.

The monetary exchange for featuring streaming services is minimal, otherwise they wouldn't be available on every TV. Actually, Apple TV is precisely the only app not available on cheap smart TVs that have Netflix, Prime, Max and Disney. You can guess why.

I really hope that something is done about the App Store monopoly worldwide. It puts app developers in a bind where they have to release on the most popular family of devices to succeed, but have no choice. they have to pay up a big chunk of the revenue for little to no reason. Why should Apple take a 30% cut of a payment when any other online payment provider takes a couple percent tops?

Apple is a bigger pig than any other company out there.

Wait, doesn’t Microsoft take a 30% commission fee for anything sold on Xbox…? I must be missing something, because that’s the most blatant ‘Rules for me, but not for thee’ I’ve ever seen.

@Balaam_ They are two different things, here Apple wants to charge for a subscription for streaming, not for the direct sale of games in its store.

This is something quite tricky, as it creates a context where third parties can not compete equally with Apple, for example if Apple creates its own video game streaming service would suffocate the competition, while its service would have a huge competitive advantage, this has happened for example to Spotify on Apple devices.

This in the long run is something they probably won't be able to do, Microsoft (and other companies like Epic) would be looking to accelerate this, it is in their interest.

On the other hand, and although it is something different, Europe is also putting the focus on the commissions charged by digital stores for selling video games. Not because the 30% commissions are wrong, it is the way these stores have to monetize, but because devices like Xbox or Playstation force you to buy in only one store available, the manufacturer's own store. It is possible that this is one of the reasons why the next Xbox may have to include third party stores.

@Trmn8r @PsBoxSwitchOwner Apple don’t get none of Netflix money anyway. As you can’t subscribe to Netflix through the App Store. You have to sign up for a subscription on a web browser or different device, so Netflix is avoiding the 30%

Microsoft could probably do the same thing that Patreon is doing by charge a higher fee for any Apple user who do does any App purchases through the App Store…

@Trmn8r I’m well aware they aren’t selling games on iPhones. The point I was trying to make is platform fees exist, MS charge them as well and 30% seems to be the industry standard. If I subscribe to FF14 on Xbox, Microsoft are going to get a cut of that subscription fee for every month, on top of a cut of any cosmetics, DLC, add ons etc. Why should it be any different if I subscribe to stream games via apple? Now if apple are trying to charge a percentage of every single gamepass sub ever then I agree it’s excessive but either way it’s just business. If users are streaming Xbox games on their phone they aren’t buying games off the App Store or subscribing to Apple Arcade so to some extent Apple is just protecting its own interests. And let’s be honest if the roles were reversed and MS was charging a fortune to put Apple TV on Xbox you would be cheering them on like there’s no tomorrow.

@Banjo- it wasn't clicking for me on what the issue was until you said this. I don't follow Apple stuff all that much nor how things work on their platform, but I never knew there was a difference between streaming fees and just regular app purchases. Thank you!

@Elbow You are welcome!

Apple provides the services and access. That costs money and R&D. They deserve their cut. If places like Epic and Microsoft don't like it, guess what - they can build a better phone so that people would buy that option. You best believe that Microsoft takes a cut of profits for every computer licensed to run Windows. I don't understand this privilege that people think companies are entitled to use another platform's service for no money. That hurts companies, huts shareholders, and ultimately hurts the economy. It's like saying that everything should be sold at cost or just given away for free.

@Frmknst
Simply every corporation will do whatever it can get away with to take consumer dollars. Anyone believing that any corporation is here solely for consumer benefits and not to load shareholders pockets with money is seriously not in touch with reality.

None are really worse or better than others. Their sole existence and goals are to make as much money as possible. The more they addict someone to their offerings the more they make and the more they make the more pressure shareholders put on them to make even more money.

I have the cloud gaming app on my Ipad, I don't get it ? Is there something Im missing here ?

Hear is what I don't understand. Sony has Playstation app which allows you to purchase ps4 and ps5 straight from the app, so long as you have a ps4 or ps5 linked to your account but MS don't allow you to purchase games directly from any Xbox app. MS does allow you to stream games that you have installed on your primary console. Sony doesn't allow any like that but instead insists you buy a PS Portal to stream games from a ps5. I don't understand how Sony is able to sell Playstation games on the Iphone in their app without paying Apple a fee? But MS doesn't want to sell subscriptions on mobile devices, I get it, but why can you buy Xbox games on the Iphone?

@GeeEssEff This is referring to game streaming. You can't offer up more than 100 games and charge a fee. Apple wants 30% of the value, not the subscription fee. That's what I'm getting out of their legal jargon. Microsoft will bypass IOS hurdles with their own storefront via a dedicated and refined web page. They're not willing to give up 30% of a sale with something like cloud gaming. It's extremely expensive to even run Xcloud on the back end.

@Hydralicmonkey Right. One of the reasons for Microsoft to release their own mobile store is to get rid of Apple's abusive policies. To those saying, "Apple will never allow a third-party store on their devices!", it's not what Apple wants, but what legal regulations state in the different regions. Remember, EU was the first to regulate loot boxes in video games.

For developers, there are significant changes to how they can charge customers and the fee structure. Developers can pay [Apple] no commission at all if they choose to distribute their apps using their own app store and payment system. Epic has announced that it will launch its own app store on iOS in the EU.

Apple created a "Core Technology Fee" for these developers, an annually fee that penalises popular apps outside their store, but that could also be modified if considered abusive by EU. Apple says that this fee is to ensure "security", but also says that they won't allow third-party stores outside EU for "security" reasons. Apple will also be forced to allow game streaming apps worldwide, but then each region would regulate or not the financial terms.