Xbox Indie Developer Shares His Concerns Following This Week's Rumours

I think people just need to wait to hear the news from Xbox themselves because the gaming community always jumps to conclusions with stories like this.

Whatever happens, it is clear the gaming community has been ridiculous over the past few days. So many overreactions based on some rumours that only state that certain Xbox exclusives will be ported to other consoles after a certain time. The way some people have reacted, you would have thought it was the end of the world.

People also need to remember that Microsoft is one of the biggest companies in the world, and that gaming is now their 3rd biggest business. More often than not, they know what they are doing and they will do whatever they think will bring in more money.

If this means changing elements of their Xbox business, then so be it. Businesses will change and adapt for the future. Considering how Xbox has brought Game Pass and Cloud Gaming to many more devices recently, they clearly want to put their games onto as many devices as possible, with as much of an influence on the public as possible. Porting certain games to PS fits right into this.

At some point, PS will also have some changes, as do all businesses. This doesn't mean that the world is ending and that everyone in the gaming community has to mindlessly speculate about it with no attempt to actually think.

Looking at the data lately the whole "people buy there specific console for exclusives is false". Fanboys buy consoles for there exclusives but they make such a small part of each eco systems numbers.

And this is exactly what I said in the other thread.

If they put any exclusives onto rival platforms without it being reciprocated, it is the beginning of the end for the ecosystem.

Nobody is going to waste their time porting games to a dieing platform that made itself irrelevant.

Even if its only a handful of games, every game announcement and every xbox direct, people will not be discussing the games, they will be asking what platforms or how long its exclusive. They will have effectively killed every single drop of hype on their platform.

Next week could make Don Mattricks E3 look like a fun family vacation

There was a rumor yesterday from MAGG (middle age gamer guy) who claims a source inside xbox told him the next gen console is still on track for '26. He was told there will be two systems again. A higher powered box and a lower powered dockable handheld.

I am curious how a possible portable will handle offline play given box's history with DRM. If they get around that and game pass titles can somehow also be played offline I will be very interested in that. Maybe it can act like Switch online games where you just need to check in online every few days.

The fact Xbox hasn't outright denied the rumours already means they're most likely true. If I was an indie dev I'd definitely lower the xbox porting priority significantly, if they -do- confirm it then I just wouldn't port to Xbox at all. The sales wouldn't be worth the cost. If Xbox as a console goes it'll just become synominous with game pass and nothing else.

@Sakai some of the people who thought the Don mattricks E3 announcements was a good idea , will still be at ms , I mean the shadowy figures who don't get mentioned , people sometimes forget the buck doesn't stop with Phil spencer , this could possibly be out of his hands.
A company doesn't become that rich by being nice.

The danger is that if Xbox hardware sales sink so low after they announce games going to the competition, 3rd parties, both big and small start pulling away from the system as it just won’t be worth it as the sales aren’t there. Speculation of course but a realistic take on the situation.

@Shushibda I've been wondering the same thing. This whole rumor week is eerily similar to Sony and the exclusives going to PC. In contrast tho, PC is essentially a forever investment for Sony, whereas porting to PS5 is a very short-term results with long-term consequences type of play for Microsoft. That doesn't seem very Phil-like. Or his team. The companies actions since completing the Acti-Blizz acquisition, do seem very corporate driven.

You are absolutely right, @Shushibda. Rumour is that the reason we have this leak is because of a disgruntled Xbox employee. Someone that is unhappy that the board at Microsoft are the ones pushing for this, not those in charge at Xbox. Microsoft only care about the bottom line and how to make the most money, that is not the same as understanding the gaming landscape and how gamers will react.

If it comes to pass that most, or all, 'exclusives' go to the PlayStation, even with an intervening period of up to 12 months, then many Xbox only players will likely jump on board the PlayStation ship at the next generational console release. With dwindling numbers buying the Xbox, and fewer still subscribed to the Game Pass, it won't be long before Microsoft puts Xbox (as a console) out of its misery. Xbox will become a third-party publisher not because that is what they intended, but as a result of Microsoft not fully appreciating what it means to be a gamer, which is to go where the best games are, and if they are all on the PlayStation, that is where you will end up...

Even if all these rumors are false, this is still a problem. If your game isn't on gamepass then it has to compete with gamepass. And if you're a small indie studio gamepass subscribers players won't even think about buying your game

This might be...

....and this is saying a LOT...

...but this might end up being the dumbest thing they've ever done. And this is a company who thought it was a good idea to try to ban sharing games.

And tried to force us to own a kinect, which the audience CLEARLY didn't want.

And tried to casually introduce DRM to their console as if it was GOOD news.

And stopped greenlighting games for over a year.

And passed on buying Insomniac.

And thought they could buy Nintendo.

And made their 2014 E3 video game conference about TV functionality instead of video games.

This might end up being THE dumbest thing.

Imagine if developers fueled the rumours fire... Oh, wait.

@Lightning720 Doom & Gloom is the way of the world!

How many times has Nintendo been doomed only to have the third best-selling console in history?

I think it's just a mindset thing. People are still hyper focused to that single plastic box being the be-all, end all, and Microsoft is not.

Maybe that does kill the dedicated console. Maybe it doesn't. Maybe you will have to get a PS6 next generation. It's not as if Forza, Halo, Gears, etc. just suddenly go away.

Sega didn't suddenly go away after it stopped making hardware.

Maybe Microsoft leaving the console market will make room for someone else to throw their hat in the ring - especially if Sony really rakes people over the coals with no one to keep it in check in the premium console market.

Maybe having a three-way split in the console market is just too much for the gaming industry to handle.

I think Microsoft will still make some kind of home console going forward, I just think it will play PC versions of games instead of making it a "closed" system and Microsoft will figure out a way to transfer everyone's console digital libraries to PC.

Welp, we needed something to replace the daily Activision Blizzard news I guess.

@cragis0001 That's simply incorrect. I have a Xbox, Playstation, and Switch strictly for their exclusives. And I currently use my Xbox for multiplats as well.

If Xbox no longer has exclusives then I'll have zero reason to buy an Xbox.

Regardless of what ends up happening with this situation, Microsoft is handling it so poorly. I can't believe they're just leaving it to spiral out of control like this.

So glad I chose not to reinvest in this ecosystem.

I mean gamepass is the only reason for alot of people to have an xbox. Besides Back Compatibility, i hop in once or twice a year for a free month of gamepass to play a 1st party game that interest me

Does xbox really care if a small indie that they passed on for gamepass and ID@xbox doesn't make a port? With those 2 services xbox will still have a strong indie presence. Like the developer said, the sales wont be there so xbox also wouldn't make money from the port either.

Why is everyone acting like MS is going to kick down our doors and take our Xbox consoles? We're lucky if we're halfway through the gen. They're hardly going to stop supporting the system. They're not Sega. Whatever happens next generation isn't worth worrying about when it's so far out. Especially not when the speculation is based on rumours that MS will port some games to playstation. People need to get a grip. Literally nothing has happened (except me losing a bit more respect for the general public).

But hey, this is coming from a guy that thinks they're entitled to a reason for why a company didn't hand him money to give his game away just because he filled out a form. Idk, maybe they've got more important things to do than explain themselves to someone they've already decided they're not interested in doing business with. Like going through the thousand other applications they recieved that day from random indy devs...

And here I thought devs would want their games on as many platforms as possible to make more money. Why is porting so hard for them when these games are made for pc and aren't big AAA level games. You can't convince me that you would lose money by porting to Xbox even if you aren't on Game Pass. If your game is even halfway decent, the cost of porting cannot be more than the sales you'd get. I just think a lot of this is posturing for financial incentives by the devs here.

@Sakai Right? Like this could end up being as much of a landmark moment as Mattrick’s spectacular Xbox One faceplant… And yet that somehow doesn’t seem nearly as bad as this.

Someone at Microsoft must be just looking at the numbers, charts, graphs and whatever else, while being ignorant of human behaviour. The comments on this site alone have already shown eagerness to get out of Xbox. That’s not the response you should ever want and I sincerely hope they’re sweating right now, because if they’re not, they no longer care.

@Trmn8r I don’t think you’ve seen how low the numbers were for Phoenix Wright the first collection. It was like 4k and no that doesn’t justify a port to the platform. It’s a miracle and GP money that we got Apollo.

Yes, there is a risk that the dev could lose money if the platform drops off completely.

@Ralizah it really isn’t being handled that poorly. We don’t know yet why they’re not saying much. There could be legal reasons why nothing is being said. They told us more answers will come next week. Unfortunately we are in a day and age where we expect answers right away, in this case, we all have to wait till then.

Moving an high profile game off the platform means the community will think all games are on the table. They may have been able to get away with it for the games like Sea and other GAAS, but the high profile single player games are a big fat no. People will second guess all games and just wait.

And the value proposition? Please sales are a thing and people would rather have all the games on one system.

People need to wake up.

If MS can make money by selling on PS (and Sony by this) they will absolutely do it. No major company gives a flying s**t about us.

This business thing Phil tweeted about, isn’t for us consumers and gamers. It’s for the board and shareholders. We just happened to find out about it early.

@EvilSilentFrame I disagree. Rumors about the viability of the brand are spiraling. This is some of the worst PR they've ever had.

This demands an immediate reaction, not "see you in a week!"

@mousieone Source? And if it wasn't on Game Pass you think that would be the sales numbers? Kind of a disingenuous example. And collections of already made games never sell as well as new games because many already played them. Also, they aren't that expensive to "develop" and port.

I just don’t see how Xbox can coast along ad infinitum with a minimal market presence, by just simply being the console for Game Pass enjoyers and those who are already locked-in to the platform via digital libraries. Xbox losing further market share just means less interest from third parties, it’s inevitable. What solution will Microsoft have to this obvious problem? I really have no idea what it could be.

I just dusted off my ps5 and put it up to date for whatever happens next week.

@Ralizah exactly. when the Series S leaked, they confirmed it almost immediately. when the court leaked tons of documents last year, they also acted immediately. Why aren’t they doing that now?

@InterceptorAlpha OK I'm wrong that it's only fanboys. But the sales numbers speak for themselves. Look at the Insomniac leak. PS2 Sony titles averaging 4 million copies sold but over 100 million consoles sold. Playstation had 123 million active users in December 2023 but there most popular title Horizon: Zero Dawn sold 28 million copies & that includes PC also. Nintendo seems to buck the trend as they just announced that Switch has sold 138 million units with the latest Mario game just selling 11 million units. But Mario Kart 8 has over 60 million units.
So it looks like outside of a Nintendo console if exclusives were as important as we are lead to believe there numbers of units sold would be higher? But there not on Xbox & PlayStation.

Look at the current top played games on Xbox there all multiplats. Minecraft & COD being two of them. Both are owned by Microsoft & are on PS5. As long as Xbox provides a choice to the consumer & top games still hit the platform it's still viable choice to the average gamer.

@Ralizah you can disagree and that’s fine, but again we do not know why they are not saying something. It could be legal reasons and then they cannot say anything. It could be structure from the inside still figuring out the direction it’s going. It could be one or more parties still need to agree on certain terms… There’s many reasons why they maybe can’t say anything yet. We all want answers, but saying something too soon if things behind the scenes are not all figured out yet would be “handling it poorly.” Then they would have to go back on their word of what was said.

Game Pass is the only reason I have an Xbox (and likely the case with a percentage of other owners). If GP ends up on playstation then there is no point me having an Xbox. BUT that doesn't really matter to MS. I'm pretty sure they don't make any money from my Xbox purchase but do from my GP subscription. They'll make pretty much the same amount of money from me either way. This is probably why they will end up ditching hardware to focus on software.

@Trmn8r sighs Capcom hack is the leak

https://gamerant.com/phoenix-wright-dragons-dogma-onimusha-capcom-sales-leak/

It didn’t come to Gamepass until last year and it launched in 2019.

As for sales of an “ collections of already made games never sell as well as new” you read the hack you’ll find Switch sold 462,000 vs Xbox’s 4,800 so no it’s a perfect example of the issues and even PS4 was over 100k. Xbox couldn’t manage double digits.

Kind of makes you realize what the dev is talking about now.

@Fiendish-Beaver oh it'll be a room full of dusty old men, pondering how much money they can make over silly childish video games, they grew up shooting deer not demons.

@Trmn8r along with what @mousieone said, wasn’t there an article on here about a limited run game that wasn’t releasing on Xbox because it didn’t expect to hit the 5k sales it needed to break even?

Why not just wait for MS to announce something? Crazy talk, I know.

@PsBoxSwitchOwner Very different situation tho. That's a collector's thing with physical copies of games that are already on Xbox. Not the same.
@mousieone you do understand audiences and Japan as a factor too right? A Japanese game on a Japanese console.
A perfect example would be a western game.

@Savage_Joe I suspect its all action stations ,and they're trying to come with the best damage control statement they can.

@Trmn8r You just need to look at the Baldur's Gate 3 saga to understand that porting from PC to Xbox isn't just the changing of a few lines of code that a lot of people seem to think is needed. There is a lot of time and effort goes into it and if a developer doesn't get the return that the feel has warranted their effort then they are well withing their rights to consider not releasing on a particular platform. It is absolutely possible that if sales are low enough on a platform it will not cover the costs for porting to that platform. It is then down to the platform holder to give the developer some sort of incentive to release on their platform. Just look at Palworld, for example. I'm sure Sony are doing everything they can to try and make sure a PS port happens due to how popular it has become.

@Trmn8r and PC isn’t big in Japan especially not in 2019 and it sold 245k on PC. That was mostly Westerners.

@Kevw2006 You are equating high end games with low end indie games. Big difference. These are games that could work on a 360 no problem.

There are also SECOND-PARTY games, and I'd be more worried about those if you're concerned about the "chopping block" of exclusives.

Or, y'all could expand perspective and realize you're not beholden to or promised certain things by Microsoft. This doesn't define you, unless you're a "content creator" being paid to talk nonsense and cause bandwagoning / build camp tentpoles.

Wow, looks like there's a whole new generation of conspiracy theorists coming up in the world!

@Ralizah given another rumor popped up about them changing the name of Xbox to MS Gaming and people ran with that. Now potentially Toys for Bob has been “closed”. And they think they can wait another 4 days? They are nuts. Everyone is racing to post as much negative Xbox news as possible. They aren’t even source checking.

@mousieone It's genuinely baffling that Microsoft doesn't seem interested in heading off the colossal amount of PR damage this is doing.

@Ralizah no joke they seem to think if they put their heads in the sand it’s all going to go away. The narrative spins further out of control. Eventually Xbox is going to be merged into PlayStation.